Its a wonderful day..**Updated 1-21-06** SHES RUNNIN!!

[TurboGTU]

PLEASE, please, PLEASE post your findings and other problems that arise or if the problem was solve. I hate it when someone (not shotting you off pontiac6ksteawd ) just goes and doens't post his findings and just dissapairs untill another problem arises or what not. Other member or future members will have/have thise problems and need to look here for reference or search for it later down the road. This is why we get plenty of .."I've searched but nothing..." . :|

 

In any event. A weak pump will do the same symptems . Runs well then it hassitates..then it dies...and won't start. Wait till the pump cools down..then again..runs...hassitates..then dies.

[pontiac6ksteawd]

Garrett Powered, Dont know who you are, and from reading what you are putting in, it sounds like apsolute useless meandering bullshit. Period, point, and check. Sorry for feeding into his thing here mods, I just dont see anything he is saying having any bearing on what my problems are.

 

Moving on...

 

I havent replaced the fuel pump as of yet, as the cost of gas is making it so I drive my more gas sipping 6000 STE. Althou it doesnt have the nice AC that the GP does, I think I can survive for now. I am only into the repairs at this point about 35 bucks. Crank sensor, fuel filter, and plugs. I returned the comp, and will be getting a J/Y unit this weekend. Never even thought about hotwiring the fuel pump. Will try that also this weekend. I am hoping its not the fuel pump, as I mentioned she has a full tank of gas. Which isnt a real big deal, as my tank has a drain plug in it. Its still an iritation thou. Will keep you updated as I make progress.

 

I hear where you are coming from TurboGTU, These are things that were already slated to be repaired/replaced anyways to just make the car more trustworthy. Since the car did sit for at least 4 years befor I bought it. Yes some of the contacts looked weathered, but not corroded. From the accident the car was in previous to those 4 years, the louvers on the hood were missing, and the fuse panel cover was off. So water, leaves, and who knows what else, got in there. I cleaned it all out the best I could when I first started working on the car. But I might have missed something. Thats another thing I am going to look into this weekend.

 

But like I said, with premium being at 3.39 a gallon, Im not in a big hurry to get it fixed. It will get fixed, hopefully soon as I miss the sound of that turbo. Luckily, I can get my turbo needs filled with my Volvo 770, but since its a Semi, its not exactly what I would call fast. But at least it is turbo charged..

[SleeperRed90TGp]

Well nuff said, I'll let it go at that. Good job pontiac6ksteawd and MODS. But still need to get your car fixed.

 

Jud

[pontiac6ksteawd]

SleeperRed90TGp, aint that the truth. Will be working on it sunday. If it is the fuel pump, it will be sitting for about a month until I need the car. With the company car (semi truck) and the wifes 6000, transportation is not a big issue right now...

[SleeperRed90TGp]

Well Brian when you get back working jump on here, there are plenty of people to walk you through the troubleshooting and the repair. Never seen a problem that wasen't solved. Some do take awhile.

 

Jud

[Garrett Powered]

Garrett Powered, Dont know who you are, and from reading what you are putting in, it sounds like apsolute useless meandering bullshit. Period, point, and check. Sorry for feeding into his thing here mods, I just dont see anything he is saying having any bearing on what my problems are.

 

Moving on...

 

I havent replaced the fuel pump as of yet, as the cost of gas is making it so I drive my more gas sipping 6000 STE. Althou it doesnt have the nice AC that the GP does, I think I can survive for now. I am only into the repairs at this point about 35 bucks. Crank sensor, fuel filter, and plugs. I returned the comp, and will be getting a J/Y unit this weekend. Never even thought about hotwiring the fuel pump. Will try that also this weekend. I am hoping its not the fuel pump, as I mentioned she has a full tank of gas. Which isnt a real big deal, as my tank has a drain plug in it. Its still an iritation thou. Will keep you updated as I make progress.

 

I hear where you are coming from TurboGTU, These are things that were already slated to be repaired/replaced anyways to just make the car more trustworthy. Since the car did sit for at least 4 years befor I bought it. Yes some of the contacts looked weathered, but not corroded. From the accident the car was in previous to those 4 years, the louvers on the hood were missing, and the fuse panel cover was off. So water, leaves, and who knows what else, got in there. I cleaned it all out the best I could when I first started working on the car. But I might have missed something. Thats another thing I am going to look into this weekend.

 

But like I said, with premium being at 3.39 a gallon, Im not in a big hurry to get it fixed. It will get fixed, hopefully soon as I miss the sound of that turbo. Luckily, I can get my turbo needs filled with my Volvo 770, but since its a Semi, its not exactly what I would call fast. But at least it is turbo charged..

 

Yo,man chill out bro I was thinking this was the other forums the whole time. I read one thread then came back to the computer and thought some moderator or something erased my post because I was helping someone with their "Mods";.when some asshole said the exact same crap to me when I was not talking to him.

 

I dont know, a lot of people have been posting the same topics on both forums and it is word-for-word so I got confused.

 

Good luck though with your problem.

 

I have been through five fuel pumps in the last year.

 

I just got a new sender unit because mine was not reading right.

[joberlee]

Do w-bodys have a fuel pump test connector? I know most older gm cars had them, makes it really easy to test the pump.

[SleeperRed90TGp]

Yes they do. It's a red wire with a tan / gray connector that comes out of the bottom of the fuel pump relay. Apply 12 volts and the pump should run. I use it to drain my tank.

 

Jud

[pontiac6ksteawd]

Well, I am still fighting with this thing. I did confirm that the fuel pump is bad. Pressure tested it, it would only go to 18 PSI and thats only if I hot wired the system to stay running so it could build up that far..

 

Now my problem is the clamps to the fill hose. I cant get mine loose, or anything. its facing striaght at the mono-leaf assembly, and I cant get to it. The GM dealer says those hoses are discontinued, so cutting them and replacement is not an option. Any one else got any ideas?? HELP!!

[joberlee]

if it's a straight, or relatively straight hose you can buy the stuff from your local parts store. They just need to know what diameter the pipes are. Costs around $10-13 per foot.

[pontiac6ksteawd]

yea, but you cant use standard rubber hoses. it has to be a fuel type line. And parts stores dont carry that large of a diameter cause fuel lines to them consist of the lines going from the tank to the motor.

[pontiac6ksteawd]

Alright, finnaly got the fuel pump installed. And I now have about 45 PSI at the schrader valve. However, the car will still not start.. I checked that the fuel injectors were getting signal from the computer, and all six were. If i spray carb cleaner in the throttle body, she runs great, but she will not start without help, and even then wont stay running without help.

 

So now we have replaced the computer, the crank position sensor, plugs, wires, fuel pump, fuel filter. I am thinking the fuel injectors are bad, or the fuel pressure regulator. But I am looking for opinions befor I do any of that. please help!!

[RareGMFan]

I wouldn't rule out the injectors, but I'm leaning towards fuel pressure regulator.

[TurboGTU]

Did you check your map sensor readings?

[joberlee]

yea, but you cant use standard rubber hoses. it has to be a fuel type line. And parts stores dont carry that large of a diameter cause fuel lines to them consist of the lines going from the tank to the motor.

 

It's called Fuel Filler Neck Hose and we stock it in diameters up to 2 1/2 inch at the NAPA where I work. It comes in three foot lengths and is sold by the foot for about $10/ foot. Murray's and autozone aren't likely to have a clue about this stuff (or about much else for that matter).

 

Joe

[pontiac6ksteawd]

im already past the filler hose thing. Was able to borrow my wifes small arms and get to it.

 

How would I go about checking my map sensor readings?

[gp90se]

Alright, finnaly got the fuel pump installed. And I now have about 45 PSI at the schrader valve. However, the car will still not start.. I checked that the fuel injectors were getting signal from the computer, and all six were. If i spray carb cleaner in the throttle body, she runs great, but she will not start without help, and even then wont stay running without help.

 

So now we have replaced the computer, the crank position sensor, plugs, wires, fuel pump, fuel filter. I am thinking the fuel injectors are bad, or the fuel pressure regulator. But I am looking for opinions befor I do any of that. please help!!

 

I had damn near the same issue with my tgp, I changed the injectors, rails with regulator, made sure it was gettin 45psi, but the fuggin thing wouldnt start worth a damn unless i shot some carb cleaner or starting fluid into the throttle body. If ya start it and drive it around for a bit, it will start up for a few hours after, and then go back to the cranking/no start issue. Im very interested to know what causes it, let me know if ya do get it figured out.

[TurboGTU]

I test it with a Volt meter..about 2.5 volts with key on..engine off. If the boost guage worked good..It would be perfectly squared on the center of the green and orange. If you remove the map..it should go all the way to vacume. If you blow on it..it should peg to the green. Bad maps show vacume or boost when the engine is off, key on. I alwyas have spares..so im lucky to just swap them out.

[Guest ChiefWiggum]

I had problems with my new GP hesitating, stalling, blowing ecm fuses and just generally acting up. Replaced plugs, tested fuel pressure, checked egr and a bunch of other things.

Problem ended up being the fuel injectors shorting out. Put in a set of new ones and the car runs like brand new. Idles nice, runs great. There are newer style injectors out since '93 that don't short out in the windings. PM JeffM, he can get them for $75 a piece. Oherwise it's about $146 a piece from the dealer.

[pontiac6ksteawd]

Alright, I am still fighting with this. I am hoping to get it fixed by the end of the weekend. I am borrowing some injectors from a 95 Pontiac 3100 and putting them in. I think they have the same plug ins as my injectors. I dont want to buy new injectors (at a total cost of 300 bucks) unless I know its the problem. I also ordered a new AC Delco Map sensor. From what I was reading, mine is bad. It was reading no boost at acceleration, wouldnt zero out at engine kill. Probly will see about replacing the FPR while I am in there. But I need this thing to be running by the end of the weekend. So stay tuned for me posting questions or whatnot... I do have some befor I start thou...

 

First, the 95 pontiac 3100 injectors i am borrowing, are coming out of a wrecked grand prix. If I can, can I leave these injectors without any Ill affects to the motor. Are they the right PSI and whatnot to not harm the motor. We all know how expensive these motors are, and I certainly cant afford that right now...

 

As mentioned earlier, I replaced the plugs, wires, CPS, fuel pump, and computer. Are there any other suggestions that I might be overlooking that would get this motor running?

[LukeZ34]

Eh.. 3100 Injectors may do more harm than good.. What Lb/hr rating are those? I highly doubt they are the 22lb/hr they the T3.1 needs. Chances are they may not even allow the car to run if they are under the needed rating. I could be wrong though.

 

Have you used a Multimeter to check the Ohm ratings of the injectors? That's a dead easy way of telling what condition they are in. Anything under 12 Ohms usually indicates a weak/failing injector.

Have you checked for spark? What about your coils and ICM, are they originals? I'd be checking for spark before I start tearing in to the injectors. If you can get your hands on a timing light to check for spark while someone else cranks the motor over, that could be a big help as well.

[Garrett Powered]

Yea, if you need an extra, let me know. Just don't use anything not off a tgp.

 

I didn't mess around, just bought all 6 when I did the manifold gaskets. so I am sure there is a few good ones in the set I took off, plus the other set I got off the red donor. And I got coils, and I got a new volt meter that works.

[pontiac6ksteawd]

Car runs just fine if I spray carb cleaner/starting fluid in it. It just isnt getting gas from the injectors. It has a new ICM and 3 coils. I have a multi meter just not sure which setting to use on them to check...

 

So the question is this then. Is there another GM or other vehicle, that uses the 22 lbs injectors?

[pontiac6ksteawd]

Alright, let me first start off by saying.. SHES RUNNING!!!!!

 

turned out to be 2 bad injectors. One on the rear bank, one on the front bank. Both of them the closest to the throttle body. The bad injectors read at 8.9 OHm and 10.9 OHm. So the windings had worn out. So I put in some TEMPORARY (capitized so I dont get murdered for it) 3.4 DOHC injectors into the 2 bad spots. Just to be sure thats whats going wrong. And then I found out my battery was completely dead and shot. So time to go to the parts store and get a new battery. Put that in, bled off the extra air in the fuel system. and she fired up like she had just been just off. No hesitation, no nothing, well, she does have a little bit of a idle surge. But I just have to do that whole idle relearn thing. So I ordered up some injectors from the stealer, since Jeff M is incognito. And those will be arriveing on wednesday. Will be installed on sunday.

 

So there it is, she is running, and I am just going to baby it to and from work until the new injectors arrive. I need my car right now, and I really dont have a choice but to do it this way. There are no service engine soon lights, no ABS lights, no brake lights. So I am plenty happy right now ..

[pontiac6ksteawd]

I managed to put some injectors in the TGP today. And I think this has COMPLETELY solved all my problems. I put them in, and she stumbled a little bit at first start up, but I think that was from some air being in the lines still. But once that cleared out, She purred like I have never heard befor. So I took her out for a test drive, not expecting to much, and was shocked to hell. I simply drove it plain and simple for the first couple miles, and then I went out onto the interstate service road. Slight brake torque and then nailed it. Wasnt all that impressive off the get go (only brake torqued it to about 1300 RPM, so I still had some turbo lag), and then she just plastered me in the seat as she smoked the tires for some 400 feet. Got up thru first gear, and shifted into second more smoothly then she has ever befor, but then she started smoking the tires again, for about 10 feet, and then it was like a second turbo kicked in, the back end of the car just sagged as the front end just lifted up and took of like a bat out of hell. I am so amazed at the power and speed from a small 3.1 moving that large car like that. I had no idea thats how these cars got its grove on.

 

I do now have a SES light on, and its a O2 sensor, which since the x-over is bad, its kinda expected. And the Brand NEW Crank Shaft Position Sensor is leaking oil OUT OF THE ELECTRICAL PLUG!!! DAMNIT!

 

Well at least I have a car to drive until things warm up a bit...