dohc v6 Posted February 4, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2008 Well I just got back from the machine shop. He told me to use 4140ph steel. He said it will never crack and machines nice. These brackets would cost anyone else 200+, but I am hooking you guys up. With that said, I need to know if all the people on the list have money in hand. I cant just make one set, so I will be putting out alot of money to have these made. I understand that you wont pay till you see the finished product, it wont be shit, so I can assure you that once its done it will meet your expectations. I am only making one run, so if you dont have money let me know. Also if you want to add your name, add now, when I get the rotors, I will be having the brackets machines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohc v6 Posted February 4, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2008 is this the final list. 1. dohc v6 - 2 sets, one 10.9 and one 11.25 2. blackbird21 - 1 Set 11.25 3.intern8tion9l - 1 set 10.9 4.Blackbombshell95 1 set of 11.25 5. Lakefxgp96 1 set of 11.25 6. GhrarhG 1 set of 10.9 7. 8. 9. 10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intern8tion9l Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 can't wait to see how this turns out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stockgp Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 so i don't have to weed through the whole thread, what was the final rotor size and price for these brackets? i have 11.25s on my tgp, wouldn't mind having bigger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 $100 for the brackets and 13" rotors are the final size.. And dohc v6, keep me on the list. Can't wait to see the brackets and snag me a set up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stockgp Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 1. dohc v6 - 2 sets, one 10.9 and one 11.25 2. blackbird21 - 1 Set 11.25 3.intern8tion9l - 1 set 10.9 4.Blackbombshell95 1 set of 11.25 5. Lakefxgp96 1 set of 11.25 6. GhrarhG 1 set of 10.9 7. stockgp 1 set of 11.25 8. 9. 10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohc v6 Posted February 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 Ok, should be getting the rotors soon, I cant wait myself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackbombshell95 Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 1. dohc v6 - 2 sets, one 10.9 and one 11.25 2. blackbird21 - 1 Set 11.25 3.intern8tion9l - 1 set 10.9 4.Blackbombshell95 2 set of 11.25 5. Lakefxgp96 1 set of 11.25 6. GhrarhG 1 set of 10.9 7. stockgp 1 set of 11.25 8. 9. 10. Updated. I am buying 2. I can't see anyone else doing this so I am going to buy another. I bet I could sell it for $300 later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohc v6 Posted February 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 Ok that works, never know I might do the same,lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z34_nut Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 I will wait for results on your car. I'm curious to see how the master cylinder reacts to a 8 piston set up vs. a 6 (total) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 I will wait for results on your car. I'm curious to see how the master cylinder reacts to a 8 piston set up vs. a 6 (total) It wont know the difference. The only thing that MIGHT be increased is the volume of brake fluid IN the calipers. However, the main design of our master cylinders have been unchanged for a while. On newer W-bodies, the main cylinder bore of the master cylinder is the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSI_MuNkY Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 I agree with Z34_nut, and I researched it as well. I don't think the stock brake booster will move enough fluid to take advantage of the increase in pistons. Everyone I have talked to about this agrees with me too. Just because the main design has remained unchanged means nothing, in later years that have more caliper pistons, all they have to do is increase the length of the booster pushrod. Not saying all this won't work, maybe you will luck out and the volumes will be close, because as there might be more pistons, they will probably be smaller pistons. But that being said whats the point of all this if you have bigger brakes and the same stopping power? But hey, I already stated that some brake company should be contacted about this, and I got shunned for it. If it were me, I'd be looking for a hydrolic booster upgrade, in fact I found one, but no one wants to listen to me.... Jamie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 I agree with Z34_nut, and I researched it as well. I don't think the stock brake booster will move enough fluid to take advantage of the increase in pistons. Everyone I have talked to about this agrees with me too. Just because the main design has remained unchanged means nothing, in later years that have more caliper pistons, all they have to do is increase the length of the booster pushrod. Not saying all this won't work, maybe you will luck out and the volumes will be close, because as there might be more pistons, they will probably be smaller pistons. But that being said whats the point of all this if you have bigger brakes and the same stopping power? But hey, I already stated that some brake company should be contacted about this, and I got shunned for it. If it were me, I'd be looking for a hydrolic booster upgrade, in fact I found one, but no one wants to listen to me.... Jamie I know of an upgraded master cylinder to go with, along with a larger brake booster if neccessary, but I highly doubt either will be neccessary to upgrade to. However there is only one way to find out BTW, the bigger brakes and the ABS more than likely wont work well together. That is a given, so anybody going to bigger brakes really needs to disable the ABS until it can be tested in a safe manner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohc v6 Posted February 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 So please explain 2 things to me. First how does Wilwood, Bear, Brembo,ect sell there brake kits? Because I know for sure that they dont include brake boosters with their big brake kits. The next thing is, using a big company to do this. I have contacted one and they told me to fuck off basically. What is so special about using a big company. I am using the best steel that you can buy,4140. Go to a machine shop that knows what they are talking about and ask them. The big companies, such as the ones listed are using aluminum for the brackets. You tell me, would you rather have steel or aluminum on your brakes? I dont know why you keep coming back to saying that we should have a big company do this. There is no reson for us to use one. And once again, its cool if you dont want to buy them before you see the brakes on my car, but if your name is not on the list, you aint getting them from me later on for $110 or about that much. Maybe Blackbombshell will sell you his extra set. No hard feelings, this is business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 dohc v6, who asked you about using a big company??? I think I missed something. Going to a big comany will only end in aggrivation like you already recieved. You have the right idea though, small machine shop will work the best obviously since you only need about 10 sets made... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohc v6 Posted February 5, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 GTPMUNKY, said that. Read up a couple posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted February 5, 2008 Report Share Posted February 5, 2008 Oh, ok. I see what you meant now... So as of now, any ETA on the finished brackets??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 i am interested and read most of the pages, let me pose my question then. The brackets are only for the front? Any why are different size rotors mentioned next to the people who are on your list? Isn't this to fit 13" rotors on the car? In other words WTF? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 i am interested and read most of the pages, let me pose my question then. The brackets are only for the front? Any why are different size rotors mentioned next to the people who are on your list? Isn't this to fit 13" rotors on the car? In other words WTF? Its for the front only. 13" rotors (GXP brakes) and the two sizes are for which brake size you currently have since the existing bracket mounting holes are different. And those existing holes are what the new bracket will mount to. I am currently working on a rear solution. 13" up front is great, but the rears still suck. I hope to have a fully completed setup withing 2 months. It's colder than hell out so obviously I havent gotten much done since my little garage has no heat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOT2B GM Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 The big companies, such as the ones listed are using aluminum for the brackets. You tell me, would you rather have steel or aluminum on your brakes? Ever think that there might be a reason that they are using aluminum? Its not because its cheaper, because it isn't. Ever heard of reducing unsprung weight? Think about it, a lot of the newer cars have aluminum subframes, spindles, caliper brackets and calipers right from the factory. All that money into engineering those pieces, and they are wrong? Just my 0.02. BTW: I think that these big brakes are a great idea, its just this whole anti-aluminum thing that caught me off guard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSI_MuNkY Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 OK, instead of argue my points, just answer me some questions... 1. What is the final price on these? in the last 2 pages I have read $200 and $110. 2. What do the "kits" include? just brackets and rotors? 3. After this initial run, will more "kits" be made available to us non believers? at what cost? 4. From the time you get money from the people on the list, how long can they expect to have to wait before their kits show up on their doorsteps? 5. What kind of guarantee are you making on these? fitment? performance? safety? 6. In light of safety, suppose one does fail, who is to blame? 7. Referring to the grade of steel, why does your machinist say that 4140 is the best choice? there are stronger steels and alloys out there, and as Matt just pointed out, the vast majority of OE components are cast aluminum. 8. Will you be making your R&D available to anyone? or at least your customers? The problem you had with wbody store was that they would not tell you where to get replacement parts, are you going to do the same thing? All ya gotta do is quote this and put your answers in bold or italics. Easy stuff. You might just make a believer of me yet.... Jamie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 OK, instead of argue my points, just answer me some questions... 1. What is the final price on these? in the last 2 pages I have read $200 and $110. $100 from what I understand 2. What do the "kits" include? just brackets and rotors? Brackets only for $100 3. After this initial run, will more "kits" be made available to us non believers? at what cost? 4. From the time you get money from the people on the list, how long can they expect to have to wait before their kits show up on their doorsteps? 5. What kind of guarantee are you making on these? fitment? performance? safety? If it fits one vehicle (his own) just fine, then it will fit all without an issue. Perfromance should be obvious of any brake upgrade. Saftey, read below. 6. In light of safety, suppose one does fail, who is to blame? The only ones to blame should and will be ourselves. That should be obvious as with any custom modification 7. Referring to the grade of steel, why does your machinist say that 4140 is the best choice? there are stronger steels and alloys out there, and as Matt just pointed out, the vast majority of OE components are cast aluminum. 8. Will you be making your R&D available to anyone? or at least your customers? The problem you had with wbody store was that they would not tell you where to get replacement parts, are you going to do the same thing? All ya gotta do is quote this and put your answers in bold or italics. Easy stuff. You might just make a believer of me yet.... Jamie I answered a couple to make a few points Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dohc v6 Posted February 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 OK I have a lot of questions to answer, and I don't mind one bit answering them all. The first question, aluminum and unsprung weight. Yes aluminum is lighter than steel, probably by 2 lbs in this case. I have been doing business with this machine shop for the last 5 years and the machinest know what he is talking bout. He owns currently 10 cnc, and numerous mills and lathes. He explained to me that using 4140 steel is the BEST oprion, seeing how OEM uses cast. He told me that aluminum is fine, and yes it works, and yes it might be chaper but not the BEST. I am not making shit, I only make the best, and thats why if you dont trust my design no worries, you can have a set made from a local machine shop, and not have to deal with me at all. Aluminum will work, its just I am building these with the best materials. If you are really worried about 5 lbs brackets, then you wont like 13" rotors, becasue they will weight more than stock. Next the numbers next to the peoples names are the size of the brakes they have on there car, please read the past pages.Now GTP Munky, 1. The final price is not yet 100% in stone, around $100-$130, powdercoated. I just mentioned that they were worht +$200 if you were to buy these from a business 2. Just the brackets, its your choice on where to get the brakes, I know rockauto sells the calipers for $50 each and $50 for each rotor. I paid $200 for just the calipers, becasue they are OEm, with pads and powdecoated. 3. No, I might make a couple more, depending on how much material is left 4. 3 days 5. Well I am going to put them on my car and drive with them, so that should answer that 6. YOU, I am making these out of the best fuckin material, it wont be the design, it will be the installer. Thats why I am going to use them first for a week or so 7. 4140ph is the strongest steel that is still somewhat easy to machine, so it will make it a little cheaper. My machinest knows what he is talking about and I belive him 100% 8. Ahhh, the part you get, you can just give to a machine shop and your done. I am not going to give you my drawings for free. Thats my work and I am not giving it out so that is can be spread over the forum and people start making them and selling them. The thing with W-Body store is they did not tell me where to get replacement parts, I told you what grade, and you will have the product. I dont know how to really answer that question. 9. Let me know if there are any other Q's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 Oh, so the brackets will be powdercoated. Sweet. The price is still great seeming it will be the cheapest of the parts and it takes the guesswork out to people not willing to do the work. lol @ the people worried about caliper bracket weight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSI_MuNkY Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 OK, I'm a little less confused... So are you looking for money up front before anything is ever made? or are you going to make and test a set for your car first? then take money? The impression I got was that you wanted all the money before anything was made, and yet you say your going to test them on your car for a week first... that kind of blows the 3 day wait out the window.... Jamie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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