Guest TurboSedan Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 well i got sick of not having a boost & A/F gauge in my Cutlass so today i stole them from my GTS i am using Autometer Phantom series 20/30 vac/boost gauge and A/F gauge, along with a pillar pod that is actually for an '84-'93 Dodge Daytona that i bought from FWDperformance.com. the pillar pod fits great and the gauges are facing directly at me while driving. i couldn't be happier with how it worked out this A-pillar pod actually fits my Cutlass better than it does my GTS. i only had time to mount the gauge and run the nylon air line for the boost gauge today, but i will be doing the wiring for the A/F guage tommarrow. onto the pics: http://www.turbosedan.com/cutlass/engine/gauges1.jpg http://www.turbosedan.com/cutlass/engine/gauges3.jpg http://www.turbosedan.com/cutlass/engine/gauges4.jpg http://www.turbosedan.com/cutlass/engine/gauges5.jpg the nylon tubing passes through the firewall right behind the clutch pedal and close to where the hood release cable passes through. i drilled a 3/8" hole in the firewall and used the grommet supplied with the gauge. the sensor wire and ground wire for the A/F guauge will pass through here as well: http://www.turbosedan.com/cutlass/engine/gauges6.jpg this looks kind of cheesy but it's only temporary. right now the boost gauge is sourced from where the HVAC/cruise used to be, and the EGR port is plugged with a cap: http://www.turbosedan.com/cutlass/engine/gauges7.jpg i will be completely removing EGR soon and a short McMaster-Carr vacuum block will be in it's place, which will be the source for the boost gauge and MAP sensor. while i was testing it today, the gauge would spike to 9psi for a split second and then hold a rock steady 8psi. as you can see, the gauge reads 1.5psi with key on engine off : http://www.turbosedan.com/cutlass/engine/gauges2.jpg so i am actually running 6-7psi because obviously the engine isn't pushing 1.5psi with the key on engine off. i don't know if it is possible to recalibrate the gauge but this is a very common problem with the Autometer mechanical boost gauges. to my dissapointment, the engine is only pulling 12" of vacuum at idle. heavy decel and it pulls 18". i was hoping it would be a little higher but eh...oh well. maybe it will improve with tuning. thanks for lookin 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sl3196 Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 Looks pretty good in there! Mine only has 12-14 for vacuum at idle so yours is probably good. My boost gauge is usually 1psi when off too. Damn it autometer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 Looks pretty good in there! Mine only has 12-14 for vacuum at idle so yours is probably good. My boost gauge is usually 1psi when off too. Damn it autometer! yeah i noticed your gauge had the same problem from one of the pics you took yesterday. my brother has the same problem with them in all of his cars. the one that used to be in his Spirit R/T was so bad he just bought a new one. actually....looking at that pic of my gauge again it is actually reading 2.5psi key on engine off (count the bars down from the 5psi mark). dammit. well, if i really am running an actual 5-6psi, than 10-11psi should make the car fly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 im -22 at vac @ idle heavy decel i get -25--26 at times my GTS had about the same vacuum. i am thinking it has alot to do with the mileage of the engine, specifically the rings. both my GTS and Cutlass have ~230,000 miles. poor GTS is a parts car now it's actually the most dependable car i own right now, and still probably the fastest btw, i had the same problems with that boost gauge when it was in my GTS. even though fuel cut is 13.7 on the GTS, i could still hold boost at an even 15psi on the gauge. sometimes the stupid thing will read 1psi off and sometimes more i'll just have to get an electronic boost gauge later on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cutty Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 where did you get that gauge pod from?? i have been looking for one for a while now, but i wanted the 3 pod one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 i got mine from FWDPerformance go to: Catalog, then accesorries, then gauges links. it is for the Dodge Daytona and cost $25. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GutlessSupreme Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 That looks pretty damn good Josh.. surprised how well it fits. i am thinking it has alot to do with the mileage of the engine, specifically the rings. both my GTS and Cutlass have ~230,000 miles. Have you ever tried dumping some Restore in your CS, out of curiosity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 nah, never have added anything. i'm skeered of that stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeZ34 Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 Damn, that looks pretty good. My cheapo ebay boost gauge isn't very accurate either, but it's better than the stock POS in the TGP. I'm curious how your A/F gauge reads on your car when you get it hooked up. I want to see if it's anything like mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 Damn, that looks pretty good.My cheapo ebay boost gauge isn't very accurate either, but it's better than the stock POS in the TGP. I'm curious how your A/F gauge reads on your car when you get it hooked up. I want to see if it's anything like mine. i will post a vid of the A/F gauge operation very soon. you'll be able to see what it does during cruise, decel, and WOT. i'll have to get the new 3-wire O2 sensor and EGR pipe fixed first though. the O2 sensor in the car right now is dead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GutlessSupreme Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 nah, never have added anything. i'm skeered of that stuff I don't know if it's alright with the turbo (though I'd imagine it's fine..) basically it fills in scratches on cylinder walls and things of that nature. I've meet a lot of people that swear by it. My friend noticed a 3mpg average increase in his 170k 3.0 Lebaron, didn't really notice a difference in power but some supposedly do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skalor Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 My TGP pulls 19 in/hg at idle and ~26 in/hg at heavy decel, and it has 130K in it. I'm guessing that it's because your mileage is so high like you mentioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jcrow Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 Hey Turbosedan, you should be able to take that gauge apart and there is a brass curved thing inside. Its like a tank that will flex under press or vac, the flexing causes the needle to move, you can bend the brass tank to zero out the gauge. Just do it carefully and little bits at a time. P.S. What octane do you run in that turbo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff M Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 If I remember correctly, the brass tube even has a name, "The Bordon Tube" and a lot of times it does have an adjustment screw or simular, or manual adjustment just don't cave-in the tube Jeff M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TGPilot Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 Josh....do not fear Restore. I have used it in every car I have owned since 1997 and I swear by it. I was running my 87 Sunbird GT with a 15% varience across the 4 cylinders. Put in restore and increased the compression on all low cylinders and they were within 1% after 3 oil changes with new restore in each oil change. BTW it was running 12 psi hot charge with 149k miles on it. Restore is the only thing I have ever seen ACTUALLY work! As for your boost gauge...You are most likely higher in elevation than where the gauge was calibrated. I do not know the construction of the gauge but if it has a sealed pressure tube or sealed bellows for the ZERO calibration/set-point then when it came up in elevation the sealed air expanded and that would be why your gauge is showing higher than zero. Auto meter should have a ZEROing adjustment screw I would think... 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 Those gauges look better then I would have thought. Nice little addition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 Hey Turbosedan, you should be able to take that gauge apart and there is a brass curved thing inside. Its like a tank that will flex under press or vac, the flexing causes the needle to move, you can bend the brass tank to zero out the gauge. Just do it carefully and little bits at a time. P.S. What octane do you run in that turbo? cool, i'll have to take the gauge out and take a look at it. i run 91 octane in the car, which is the highest octane available here. Kenny - i may have to try some Restore. i have not yet done a compression test but i will soon. so i take it Restore is ok to use with a turbocharger? just want to be sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jcrow Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 I was wondering how it would run on 87 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 13, 2005 Report Share Posted September 13, 2005 hmmm not sure. i don't want to take a chance and find out though i used to run 85 when it was NA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 14, 2005 Report Share Posted September 14, 2005 i finished wiring up the gauges this afternoon. here's how i did it: boost gauge light: - positive wire to 12V switched dimmer wire at the fog light connector - ground to a 10mm bolt for parking brake pedal bracket using a ring terminal A/F: - positive wire to 12V switched power from my stereo harness - ground directly to - battery terminal using a ring terminal - sensor wire to O2 sensor wire on the engine harness side (not O2 side so i don't have to splice all over again when i install the new O2 sensor) i used solder, a bit of paste flux, & heat shrink tubing for all connections. i even used a little solder & flux with both crimped ring terminals. i had previously thought the O2 sensor was dead but it does work. the A/F lights started bouncing after i drove the car about a block. i haven't seen what happens at WOT yet, i'll try to get a vid posted of the A/F gauge operation tomarrow. i'll get the boost gauge in the vid too so you can see that at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 14, 2005 Report Share Posted September 14, 2005 well, i'll have to get a vid during the daytime. i tried tonight but i could barely see anything in the vid i got. some observations: - at idle the A/F gauge swings mostly in the stoich area. it seems to go as low as about 2 red lights and as high as 2 green lights during idle. sometimes it will swing lower into the lean area but only as high as 2 green lights. seems pretty normal to me. - at steady cruise it swings between full lean (all red lights lit) and as high as 2 green lights lit. so far so good. - at WOT (6psi) i am getting every green light lit up except the last one. as i get up higher in the RPM just before i shift the last green light starts to light up. this is good i don't think i'll be running out of fuel anytime soon. so far it's looking like 10-11psi won't be a problem. - during heavy decel the gauge goes full lean; only the last red light was lit. again, normal. however during light decel the guage was still swinging, ie closed loop! WTF! it should still show full lean during light decel as it does during heavy decel. to me this illustrates the horrible bucking problem i am having with the car during light decel. in my GTS the gauge reads full lean even during light decel and i have no bucking problem to speak of with that car. i have no idea how i will go about fixing this problem. i don't know if it the cause could be the speedo being way off, the leaking EGR pipe or something else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 14, 2005 Report Share Posted September 14, 2005 oh i know i just need to buy a laptop off ebay. that's all i need to start datalogging. by the way, i've been meaning to ask you - what software is on the CDR you sent me with the Mastach cable? the leaking EGR tube is basically the same thing as a cracked crossover, and i know that can cause big problems. haven't had time to get to the local salvage yard yet, but i'm hoping i can find one later this week. i should have my ATP weld-on BOV adapter put on my lower IC pipe next week too. i'll be using my brother's TurboXS RFL (as in Really Fuckin' Loud) BOV for awhile until i buy my own BOV. i'll have to get a sound clip of that monster anyways, i am not going to raise boost until i get the EGR pipe fixed, new ICM, coilpacks and wires, and the BOV installed. the car is fun enough for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 14, 2005 Report Share Posted September 14, 2005 downloaded thanks Dave! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 14, 2005 Report Share Posted September 14, 2005 cool i am hoping to be able to order the Willem EPROM programmer, a few EEPROMs and a Moates G1 adapter by the end of the month. although i might just cut the stock EPROM out of my extra NA 3.1/5-speed memcal and solder in a test socket for an EEPROM instead of the G1 adapter. i'm not sure what i'll do yet. it's all new to me but i can't wait to get started Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TurboSedan Posted September 14, 2005 Report Share Posted September 14, 2005 that wiliam burner is nice too......but really needs some kinda housing or casing... i have considered the Transtronics Pocket Programmer 2 for that reason, but it's more expensive. eh...i think i could make my own case for the Willem. anyways, i will try to post a vid of my A/F gauge operation tomarrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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