Scottster Posted March 21, 2009 Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 So I finally got around to getting the 20 year old rubber replaced on my subframe mounts. The front end had the ubiquitous clunking and banging as the car went over severe and minor undulations and bumps in the road. It certainly felt to me like the sub frame was loosy-goosy, and having replaced the struts, strut mounts, and both inner and outter swaybar bushings within the last two years, I was confident this would fix the problem. No. The rubber that came out of there certainly needed replacing. It sort of looked like artifacts recovered from the Titanic. When I saw that, it was a huge feeling of relief knowing what good would come from putting fresh rubber in there. I'll try and get some pics of them when I go back on Monday to pay my mechanic. I was keeping him company as he did the job and asked him to hold on to them. I was considering doing the job myself, but meh... So I'm running out of options here, and begining to consider going back to the struts. They are sensa "craps" and I bought them around the time they had that recall going on. Didn't keep the recepts (stupid) so I won't be eligible for free replacements, but I was going to go the KYB route anyway if I did take the jump on replacing them. Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted March 21, 2009 Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 what about your balljoints? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slick Posted March 21, 2009 Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 My KYB has clunked since day 1. It still functions properly, so I just deal with it. It's hard saying. You could have bad mount/strut already, which isn't hard to believe. Could be a ball joint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5speedz34 Posted March 21, 2009 Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 There was a recall on sensa-tracs? First I would check your ball joints and tie rods. If nothing is wrong there start to go after the strut tower, the spring seats and bearings never get replaced in these cars and I wouldn't be surprised if they are bad. The only other thing I can think of is maybe the engine mounts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White93z34 Posted March 21, 2009 Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 Inner tie rods. check them. sometimes when those go they will make a ungodly sounding bad clunking noise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottster Posted March 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 When I did the struts I replaced those big bearings at the top too. I should really do some of the work myself to get to know each component, but the guy I go to treats me well and I trust him...at my own experiences expense I guess. I'll have the ball joints and tierods checked out. I remember reading of a recall from Monroe around the time I picked my struts up. I had just gotten the car and wasn't too discriminating. I suppose I should have been and I wouldn't be questioning them now. As for KYBs that clunk being new...that would piss me off more than anything. I suppose that's how I feel right now pouring money into the car with no results. Is it too much to ask for a solid new-car-like ride? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q-Ball Posted March 21, 2009 Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 Hey Scott, did you get quick struts installed? Or just the actual strut itself? Where are you hearing the clunk? Front or back? It could just you need to grease your ball joints or tie rods. Make sure everythings tight. I had a outer tie rod loose on my regal. I torqued it to spec and I took it in for a safety and that was found. Make sure there is no play in them. (up and down) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted March 21, 2009 Report Share Posted March 21, 2009 Lower spring seat bearings... While stopped, turn the wheel back and forth, first slowly, then get faster with it. If it makes the noise, and balljoints/tie rods are good, then 90% chance its the lower spring seat bearings, 10% chance its the rack or rack mounts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfewtrail Posted March 22, 2009 Report Share Posted March 22, 2009 If you have the w-body strut tool, make sure the retainer nuts on your struts are tight. I've had one loosen up before after several years and it sounded pretty rough over bumps and such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOT2B GM Posted March 22, 2009 Report Share Posted March 22, 2009 Sounds stupid, but make sure the 2 rack mounting bolts to the subframe are tight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted March 22, 2009 Report Share Posted March 22, 2009 If you have the w-body strut tool, make sure the retainer nuts on your struts are tight. I've had one loosen up before after several years and it sounded pretty rough over bumps and such. Yeah, its a PITA to get them tight enough without using an impact.. Ive had to retighten mine on most of m Ws until I started using an impact to tighten them.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5speedz34 Posted March 22, 2009 Report Share Posted March 22, 2009 Scott, you can rent the tool or call me and I can loan it to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mra32 Posted March 23, 2009 Report Share Posted March 23, 2009 I was in the same boat as you. I had some clunking over bumps and was sure that my subframe mounts were going to give out at any moment. I replaced the mounts and drove around the block to the messed up section of pavement that always made my car clunk and was very disappointed when the sound was still there. I thought that the only other thing that it could be at that point was the strut. Once I borrowed an offset wrench, I tightened down the top nut on the strut and my clunking problem disappeared. That clunking was there for almost a year before I tightened down that nut and made me feel rather silly. So check those top nuts. The ones that hold it in the strut tube would also be good ones to check. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottster Posted March 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 I'll check on all thsoe points guys. Thanks for all the tips. I tried turning the wheel back and forth at a standstill...no noise. It sure as hell does it at a low speed going over speedbumps with the pass.side wheel. CLUNK-A-BANG is more like it. I know the steering rack bolts are tight, or at least they were as of the summer. I remember you writing that up on the TGP in a post Matt, and I've kept an eye on those babies since. I'm going to have some time tomorrow to run by the shop, and I'll poke around in there with all of this info you guys have shared. Scott, you can rent the tool or call me and I can loan it to you. If he doesn't have one, I'll totally take you up on that. Thanks man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottster Posted March 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 Well you guys got me all fired up that tightening those bolts would make life happy again... Nope. I went in this morning and we poured over all the suspension bits. Ball joints...Good Tierods...Good Spring seat bearings...like new. Those big nuts on the top if the strut...Good and tight (he had the tool). All the rubber had been replaced, so the inner and outer swaybar bushings are golden. Sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.................................................................. Do I need to take it up the rear and replace relatively new struts now? One more detail about the noise is that it seems isolated to one side being agitated. For example if you go over a speed bump straight...solid as a rock. Hit it at an angle so one wheel hits before the other = clunking. Driving down the road is the same thing...if only one wheel goes over bumps, the thing bangs around like crazy. If the whole road is consistently bumpy...Not so mucha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mra32 Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 i didnt see that you made sure that the 15/16th nut at the top of the strut rod was tightened, but I guess you would have had to retighten that if you got the tool in to tighten one that actually holds the strut in the knuckle. and you said all your rubber was fine...including your control arm bushings? If all that is good, then im thinking its the strut itself or some sort of interference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottster Posted March 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 i didnt see that you made sure that the 15/16th nut at the top of the strut rod was tightened, but I guess you would have had to retighten that if you got the tool in to tighten one that actually holds the strut in the knuckle. and you said all your rubber was fine...including your control arm bushings? If all that is good, then im thinking its the strut itself or some sort of interference. Is it the torx drive that actually tightens the shock? I Haven't replaced the control arm bushings either. If I am going to replace the strut cartridges ($45 from Tirerack) would it be advised to do the mounts too ($24)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mra32 Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 Well on my kyb's there was a socket head broached in the top and you hold the strut rod stationary with an allen key and tighten down on the nut that holds it in the mount with the offset wrench. You looked at your strut mounts today, I assume, how did they look? I dont think the fronts need replacement like the rear ones do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottster Posted March 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 Well on my kyb's there was a socket head broached in the top and you hold the strut rod stationary with an allen key and tighten down on the nut that holds it in the mount with the offset wrench. You looked at your strut mounts today, I assume, how did they look? I dont think the fronts need replacement like the rear ones do. Right, that's how I thought the concept worked. And the rubber that I could see looked like brand new on the mounts. I think I'm going to be cheap for now and try the control arm bushings. I hadn't thought of that before as a significant wear point, but I'll only be doing some good to replace them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mra32 Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 I would just say look at them, i dont think they would really be so bad to require replacement, but it wouldnt hurt, I just threw it out there since it hasnt been said. Unlikely but possible, it doesnt hurt to cover all your bases Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottster Posted March 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 So just to be sure of what I'm thinking... 5 is the rubber I could see through the top, and it compressed when the weight of the car was let down. 6 is made of steel or rubber? They call it an insolator, but it looks like where the spring sits, so I would think it would be steel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted March 24, 2009 Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 So just to be sure of what I'm thinking... 5 is the rubber I could see through the top, and it compressed when the weight of the car was let down. 6 is made of steel or rubber? They call it an insolator, but it looks like where the spring sits, so I would think it would be steel? Ok... 4- The upper mount plate, steel, above 4 would be the rubber strut mount! 5- A urathane foam bumper, wont cause any noises 6- Upper spring seat, its rubber, wont cause a clunk, can squeak and bind, and maybe the spring to shift 7- Strut boot 6- Lower spring seat, same as 6 and can cause the same noises when its bad 9- Lower spring seat bearing plate, can cause binding (causes memory steer) and can cause a clunk!! When it goes bad, they can get loose and make a clunk noise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottster Posted March 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2009 Hum, so it's not even in the diagram...nice. Thanks for clarifying. Like I said, the lower spring seat bearings are golden...replaced when I initally did the struts and they are still pivoting freely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXX Posted March 25, 2009 Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 Hum, so it's not even in the diagram...nice. Thanks for clarifying. Like I said, the lower spring seat bearings are golden...replaced when I initally did the struts and they are still pivoting freely. Ok, I know spring seats do that as mine do. They shift over and contact the strut body causing the clunk. I also get some wicken memory steer (like a perminant pull) from it binding. I have a better idea for you to look at.. You did one of a few things when installing the struts. 1- The nut retaining the cartridge in has come loose (it happens more than you think) they are designed to have quite a bit or torque applied 2- When installing the new cartridge, you should have poured in some motor oil, 10-30 works. You should then install the cartridge slowly (some will leak out, make sure to clean up your mess!! ) This is done to keep noise down as the cartridge can contact the sides!! It does happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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