1990lumina Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 Could it be done? I've been sorta looking for either a 3.4 or a 3800 series 1 to swap into my Lumina. My dad told me the 3800 is a strong and reliable engine. The only OBD1 3800 engine is from an early Regal right?? Would a 3800 be able to be swapped into my Lumina, and use most of the same wiring and same transmission (4T60)? I've also been looking at possibily doing the 3.4 swap, but (I'm not trying to satrt a flame war) I'd like a little more reliable engine. I know my 3.1 thats in there now is probably the most reliable egnine I've owned, and I'm thinking the 3800 would be decently reliable as well. And no, I don't want to do the #800 Series II Super charged engine swap (L67 right??) just because I don't want all the hassle lol.. So, any insightwould be helpful, and I might start shopping around for a nice series 1 3800 with decently low miles on it. Thanks! - Jeff L. 90sEraWhips 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White93z34 Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 suppsedly its prety easy, but honestly if your current 3.1 is relyable and runs good then i woulden't mess with perfection, engine swaps can turn into HUGE nightmares, and if your just after better relyability then you should probably stay with what you have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1990lumina Posted March 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 Well, I'm after a little more power, but I'd like to keep it fairly reliable. I know if I could find a low miles 3.4, and take care of it it would probably last me a long time, but the chances of me finding one will be pretty slim. If I knew I could add some power to my current motor I would, but I know there isn't much I can do to get more power out of it. To me the 3.1 is extremely detuned, but I also know it will last forever. It is sort of like my dad's 95 Taurus w/ 3.0L Vulcan - it is extremely detuned but it will probably out last a few transmissions lol. Honestly, I don't want to turbo charge my current engine either. I'd like to keep everything natural aspriated. Any opinions? Oh, and if someone can tell me this it would be awesome - how more power did the early 3800s put out? was it more or less then the 3.4? Thanks - Jeff L. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiscoStudd Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 The 91-95 L27 (3800 Series I) put out 170 HP and 225 lb/ft of TQ. You could always swap in an L36 (3800 Series II) and use the wiring and computer from, say, a 91 Regal with the L27. The L36 puts out 200 HP and 235 TQ, and will run on the older L27's OBD-I computer. IIRC, the L27-equipped Regals received the 4T60-E starting in 91, so you may want to swap in an "E" tranny to go along with that L36 (the 96 Regals could be equipped with the L36/4T60-E combo, but had OBD-II.) 90sEraWhips 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartonmd Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 I don't know anything about how easy a swop it'd be, but I'll tell you, a 3800 is as close to a bullet-proof engine as GM ever put out... It's comparable to a SB chevy for durability... The 3.1 and 3400 have that cool intake gasket thing goin' on and the 3.4 has that cool, 40,000 mile timing belt... The only thing I'll say about the 3800 series I is, they were not yet counterbalanced, and a 90 degree V6 like the 3.8 and 3800 has 2 out of balance moments per cycle, whereas a 60 degree V6 only has one, as does a 90 degree V8... although it's not as bad as the 3 moments per cycle of an inline 4... so... they'll shake a bit at idle specifically... not a big deal once moving, but every time I drive my Bonneville, I find myself sitting at a stop light wondering if it's going to die because I drive the Lumina all the time when I'm not riding my bike... the 3.8 just feels different... On the other hand, they do run DISGUSTINGLY well for what they are... My '87 bonne with the 3.8 is quite a bit faster than my '92 euro 3.1 and the bonne's a bigger car and has the 3.8 and not the 3800 I. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White93z34 Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 thats one thing i LOVE about the 60* v6 over the 90* v6, its IMO, a much smoother engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RacerX Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 What are your performance goals? Seems to me like you're not very ambitious when it comes to performance. My previous car, a '92 GP SE with 3.1/4-speed auto, was a good performer for what it was after I made a few minor improvements: - K&N drop-in airfilter - Reworked stock airbox (inside section of snorkel cutout, all sharp corners blended) - TB polished - Rapidfire Sparkplugs - MSD 8.5mm Superconductor ignition wires - Hypertech Thermostat - Hypertech Thermomaster performance chip (designed for use with the cooler thermostat) By the way, one of the cars I beat in a street encounter with that car was a early 90's Regal GS 3800 Series I sedan. After the guy driving it raced around me like he had something fast I couldn't help going for it when we got a light to go from. I nosed him out of the hole by a foot, lost a few inches shortly after, but started pulling away once the 3.1 came up on 4000 rpm. I think the guy gave up around 45 mph after I had put him about a carlength behind me. Not bad for a wheezer. Also, when I had traded it in for the 96 Z34, the SOTP feel was nearly identical from idle through 4500 rpm, and not too far behind the LQ1 up to 5000 rpm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cutlass1991 Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 My parents have a 93 olds shilloette with the 3800 and a 4t60. i guess that would be obdI. its up around 180,000 on its 2nd trans (rebuilt) but theres never been a problem with the motor. i bet if you found an old van u could use that for a swap in addition to a regal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
95 3-4 Posted March 29, 2005 Report Share Posted March 29, 2005 You need a new radiator, probably a new dogbone mount to bolt to the core support or modify yours, I recomend a engine wiring harness out of the same year W that had a 3.8, exhaust is spot on, airbox is different/irrelevant. I put 12-15 hours/beers/ciphering into making my 92 harness work in a 95 bulkhead connector but iza runner. Main things were fuel pump trigger, hot start wire to solenoid, oil light kill, low coolant light, and icm power I believe, It would have been much easier if I had pinouts for the 2 bulkhead connectors, sadly I didnt and I wasnt about to pay alldata a bunch of money for info Your older 4T60 will work fine and is longer lasting and more reliable than the E version, unless you want some fake *feature* like "second gear start" 188k on the 92 3.8/4T60 when the trans started getting weak and sloppy, 95 4T60E died @ 98k and the 3.4 got thrown away at the same time, best thing that ever happened to the car. The spirit of the Regal lives on in the Boniack 191k just changed the oil last week. The spirit of the 3.4 lives on in laugh.......pos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EurosportZ34 Posted March 30, 2005 Report Share Posted March 30, 2005 You could always swap in an L36 (3800 Series II) if he's spending all that time with the L36 he might just as well go the L67 route... BTW, i think an L27 would be pretty cool in a W other than the Regal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfewtrail Posted March 30, 2005 Report Share Posted March 30, 2005 I vote L27/series I 3800 swap! The L27 is a decent step up from a 3.1. It should drop a full 1-1.5 seconds off your 1/4 mile times if you care about that. Then you could always do a few simple modifications(fender well intake, catback, etc.) and gain a little more power. I would like to see someone turbocharge a series I motor, but most don't seem to bother w/ the series I engines(some of the Bonneville guys are starting to though since they now have cams, rockers, heads, etc. available for them). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianteel Posted April 3, 2005 Report Share Posted April 3, 2005 get the series 2 motor has mor power and will bolt in the same. like what they siad up top you can use the regal harness. you can also do the supercharged motor the same way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curlybandit Posted April 3, 2005 Report Share Posted April 3, 2005 My 1991 Regal has the 440T4 (4T60). It wasn't until 1993 when they started getting the 4T60-E. Such a shame... It would make swapping engines so much easier... Curlybandit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianteel Posted April 3, 2005 Report Share Posted April 3, 2005 My 1991 Regal has the 440T4 (4T60). It wasn't until 1993 when they started getting the 4T60-E. Such a shame... It would make swapping engines so much easier... Curlybandit you canuse a 93 harness on your car. you just need to check the pins and make sure they are right. then you could use that trans and any engine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curlybandit Posted April 3, 2005 Report Share Posted April 3, 2005 Interesting..... I don't know enough to make an educated guess, but my understanding is that the 440T4 requires manifold vacuum to the modulator valve and throttle input via the throttle valve cable to shift, not ECM control via solenoids with manifold vacuum like the newer engines equiped with the 4T60-E. So is it simpy a matter of reworking the wiring, or do you need to compensate for the lack of TV cable use in the newer engines? Also, can a 440T4 hold up to the power increase of an L36 or L67? My guess would be that it would get torn to shreds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianteel Posted April 3, 2005 Report Share Posted April 3, 2005 there is alot of options...you can go as far as using a 94 or 95 harness with the supercharged moitor and a 4t60e. i have been doing alot fo research on this to find even cheaper options or the L67 swap and other motor swaps in GM cars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curlybandit Posted April 3, 2005 Report Share Posted April 3, 2005 Damn that was quick.... :shock: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianteel Posted April 3, 2005 Report Share Posted April 3, 2005 if you need more info let me know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
94CutlassSLCoupe Posted April 4, 2005 Report Share Posted April 4, 2005 I would think a 3100 top end swap would be easier...use the 2000-up parts and it should crank just as much as an L27...and use your stock block and electronics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianteel Posted April 4, 2005 Report Share Posted April 4, 2005 you would be surpriesed on how much harder it is to pull the topend of a motor off then it is too pull the whole thing and replace it wiht something else Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GP1138 Posted April 4, 2005 Report Share Posted April 4, 2005 you would be surpriesed on how much harder it is to pull the topend of a motor off then it is too pull the whole thing and replace it wiht something else Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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