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Good oil change interval?


gr8shot
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I'll keep changing my oil every 1500-3000 miles depending on operating conditions and how I drive the car. It only costs me $16 and I still get paid .3hrs to do so.

 

Cheap insurance.

ABSOLUTE waste of money and resources. 'Course, it is YOUR money; and at least around here the shops love having the used oil for use in the waste oil furnaces.

 

It's not 1970 any more. Feedback fuel control and overdrive transmissions make the frequent oil changes unneeded UNLESS THE VEHICLE HAS MECHANICAL DEFECTS that lead to oil contamination.

 

 

 

Folks around here seem to look up to you. You could set a better example...

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ABSOLUTE waste of money and resources. 'Course, it is YOUR money; and at least around here the shops love having the used oil for use in the waste oil furnaces.

 

It's not 1970 any more. Feedback fuel control and overdrive transmissions make the frequent oil changes unneeded UNLESS THE VEHICLE HAS MECHANICAL DEFECTS that lead to oil contamination.

 

 

 

Folks around here seem to look up to you. You could set a better example...

 

We don't use waste oil for heat at work. My engine has 151K, and even my other W-bodies with 3100 and whatnot do a great job of contaminating the shit outta the oil, especially the 3.1mpfi with it's awsome sealing rings:roll: (Compression tests fine on this engine)

 

Tis not a low mileage engine, nor were the ones in my past. There's just no way to get around an oil change interval of the mileage I posted. The engine's don't have mechanical or running issues (Except my old 250K mile Vert) They are just dirty ass engines.

 

And if I run the car hard, more so than usual, it's getting a oil change sooner.

 

 

Hell, EVERY Tech I know or have worked with, even verteran Master Techs NEVER let their cars go over 3000 miles for an oil change. Why? It's cheap enough to do, and we see how the oil looks when being drained.

 

Personal preference. If you wanna reuse your engine oil, that's fine. But no way in fuck I am doing that or going 5000miles on a shitty old engine with 120K plus on them.

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ABSOLUTE waste of money and resources. 'Course, it is YOUR money; and at least around here the shops love having the used oil for use in the waste oil furnaces.

 

It's not 1970 any more. Feedback fuel control and overdrive transmissions make the frequent oil changes unneeded UNLESS THE VEHICLE HAS MECHANICAL DEFECTS that lead to oil contamination.

 

 

 

Folks around here seem to look up to you. You could set a better example...

 

So could you. Not all engines are built equal. I said it once and I'll say it again. When I had the L27, Series I 3800 in the regal, there was a noticeable roughness in the way the engine ran if I let it go past 3500 miles on an oil change. One time I got some 5K mile extended life oil, and by 5k miles, it was nowhere near as smooth as it should be. I realized how bad it really we as once I changed my oil. I tried letting it go to 4k miles the next time and had the same experience but to a lesser degree. In the end, I understood without a single doubt that this engine NEEDED an oil change every 3000 miles and I had little wiggle room past that.

 

With oil changes being so cheap, that peace of mind is worth something to me. I went 217k miles on that engine, having abused it since 61k and having overheated it well over 6 times.

I'm not taking any chances with the L67 that's in there now. Oil change every 3K and and I'm not giving myself more than 100 miles past that.

 

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I love how people think that their opinions are fact. Oil change intervals are purely up to the car owner. If someone wants to change their oil every 400 miles that's their right. If they never change the oil they have their car, that's also their right.

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Hell, EVERY Tech I know or have worked with, even verteran Master Techs NEVER let their cars go over 3000 miles for an oil change.

I can't argue that; but it's also true that you don't know, and have never worked with me.

 

Why? It's cheap enough to do, and we see how the oil looks when being drained.

Of course, "how the oil looks" doesn't mean much. Thus the need for oil sample testing/analysis in a laboratory.

 

So could you.

No offense to you. You've missed the point. I've been relieved of that duty; see my signature line. ;)

 

...there was a noticeable roughness in the way the engine ran if I let it go past 3500 miles on an oil change. One time I got some 5K mile extended life oil, and by 5k miles, it was nowhere near as smooth as it should be. I realized how bad it really we as once I changed my oil. I tried letting it go to 4k miles the next time and had the same experience but to a lesser degree. In the end, I understood without a single doubt that this engine NEEDED an oil change every 3000 miles and I had little wiggle room past that.

Alright, you say old oil caused engine roughness; and you seem to be correct since replacing the oil fixed the roughness. Assuming that it wasn't psychosomatic, we're left with the big question: "What is there about 3500 mile oil that could CAUSE engine roughness?"

 

Since the problem immediately goes away with an oil change; it can't be anything that would remain in the engine when the old oil is drained. It's a shame that you didn't get that oil analyzed, finding out what was wrong with the oil would have put you on track for discovering the underlying problem with the engine. You wouldn't have needed to "band aid" the problem with frequent oil changes.

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I can't argue that; but it's also true that you don't know, and have never worked with me.

 

 

Of course, "how the oil looks" doesn't mean much. Thus the need for oil sample testing/analysis in a laboratory.

 

 

No offense to you. You've missed the point. I've been relieved of that duty; see my signature line. ;)

 

 

Alright, you say old oil caused engine roughness; and you seem to be correct since replacing the oil fixed the roughness. Assuming that it wasn't psychosomatic, we're left with the big question: "What is there about 3500 mile oil that could CAUSE engine roughness?"

 

Since the problem immediately goes away with an oil change; it can't be anything that would remain in the engine when the old oil is drained. It's a shame that you didn't get that oil analyzed, finding out what was wrong with the oil would have put you on track for discovering the underlying problem with the engine. You wouldn't have needed to "band aid" the problem with frequent oil changes.

 

3000 miles constitutes frequent oil changes? I tried this a few times since I bought the car whether its because I was on a road trip, or because I simply didn't have the time. There was nothing wrong with the engine. There is however something wrong with you telling people that 3000 mile oil change intervals are "frequent." There is zero detriment in changing oil too soon. There is however a detriment in changing oil too late.

 

What caused engine roughness? I could only assume it was the contaminants in the oil. Considering it only started at around 3500 miles and got more noticeable at 4000 miles, I can safely say that the 3000 mile oil changes were appropriate.

 

As I said in my last post, all engines are not created equal. As someone else also said, it is up to the owner to determine, although I certainly wouldn't recommend waiting too long to change your oil.

 

When giving this kind of advice, consider that whoever listens to you can potentially end up with premature motor wear and more frequent failures, the cost of which doesn't get covered by the $10 you save doing oil changes less frequently. If you get it tested, more power to you, but if you don't, then follow the manufacturer's recommendations.

 

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http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/11/your-money/11shortcuts.html

http://autos.yahoo.com/articles/autos_content_landing_pages/586/the-3000-mile-oil-change-myth/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3,000_mile_myth

http://www.calrecycle.ca.gov/UsedOil/OilChange/

http://theweek.com/article/index/207073/the-3000-mile-oil-change-myth

 

You can change your oil at 3000-miles if you want, but you're wasting your time and money. The only ones standing to gain from 3000-mile oil changes is the oil industry and Jiffy Lube. If you like putting your hard-earned money into the pockets of big business, I guess we don't share that in common.

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http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/11/your-money/11shortcuts.html

http://autos.yahoo.com/articles/autos_content_landing_pages/586/the-3000-mile-oil-change-myth/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3,000_mile_myth

http://www.calrecycle.ca.gov/UsedOil/OilChange/

http://theweek.com/article/index/207073/the-3000-mile-oil-change-myth

 

You can change your oil at 3000-miles if you want, but you're wasting your time and money. The only ones standing to gain from 3000-mile oil changes is the oil industry and Jiffy Lube. If you like putting your hard-earned money into the pockets of big business, I guess we don't share that in common.

 

Do you read what you quote? "With vehicles made before 2002, you should probably stick with the 3000 mile oil change interval."

 

If I remember correctly, this same crap was posted before, and I responded in the exact same way.

 

Its the "theweek.com" article btw.

 

Even the article from calrecycle says "many cars." Not all, not most, but many. You're stating it as a global fact.

 

Even the wiki makes it clear that you should follow the manufacturer's recommendations. Just because its a myth with the newest cars doesn't mean its its a universal myth with all cars.

 

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Do you read what you quote? "With vehicles made before 2002, you should probably stick with the 3000 mile oil change interval."

 

If I remember correctly, this same crap was posted before, and I responded in the exact same way.

 

Its the "theweek.com" article btw.

 

Even the article from calrecycle says "many cars." Not all, not most, but many. You're stating it as a global fact.

 

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Nah, I only skimmed. If they said that thing about 2002, then I don't agree with them there. Believe me, I'm way older than you and have been on automotive forums for over a decade longer, this same debate has been around since I started driving in the early 90's and the articles about the "myth" have said the same thing. The years in the articles and names of people quoted change, but the content is the same. People, including manufacturers, have been saying 3000-mile intervals are excessive even when this debate was on FidoNet (before public Internet).

I've been driving the SAME cars with 4500-5500 mile intervals since before most of our newest members were even born and they're better than fine. Not to mention nobody here other than me needs a car to hold up to daily-driver duty for 17+ years, and I'm certain the engine will outlast pretty much everything else in the car (transmission, body, frame), so what's the point of being paranoid about it? 3000-mile oil changes are truly just a waste of time and money, but I wholeheartedly support your right to waste your own time and money. :thumbsup:

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3000 miles constitutes frequent oil changes?

YES--for vehicles with feedback fuel control and overdrive transmissions, that are in good operating condition and run long enough to appropriately warm the oil.

 

Almost certainly not for rough-idle "home-built hot-rods" that misfire at idle, run too rich at cruise, and have mis-adjusted (or missing) chokes.

 

Non-feedback, non-overdrive vehicles in good condition...No telling without oil sampling.

 

There is zero detriment in changing oil too soon.

If that was true...we'd change oil every twenty miles. The goal is to get as much life out of the oil as practical--and that means for modern engines/vehicles, oil "useful life" is WAY longer than in 1970.

 

What caused engine roughness? I could only assume it was the contaminants in the oil.

Of course.

 

Considering it only started at around 3500 miles and got more noticeable at 4000 miles, I can safely say that the 3000 mile oil changes were appropriate.

Mistake in logic. The SYMPTOMS showed up at 3500; but the contamination was building up from Day One of the oil change. If you'd repaired the root cause of the contamination...you'd have gotten better oil life.

Edited by Schurkey
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YES--for vehicles with feedback fuel control and overdrive transmissions, that are in good operating condition and run long enough to appropriately warm the oil.

 

Almost certainly not for rough-idle "home-built hot-rods" that misfire at idle, run too rich at cruise, and have mis-adjusted (or missing) chokes.

 

Non-feedback, non-overdrive vehicles in good condition...No telling without oil sampling.

 

 

If that was true...we'd change oil every twenty miles. The goal is to get as much life out of the oil as practical--and that means for modern engines/vehicles, oil "useful life" is WAY longer than in 1970.

 

 

Of course.

 

 

Mistake in logic. The SYMPTOMS showed up at 3500; but the contamination was building up from Day One of the oil change. If you'd repaired the root cause of the contamination...you'd have gotten better oil life.

 

I'm sure I would have had better oil life, but I probably also would have been out of several hundred dollars, or more than the cost of doing oil changes every 3k instead of 5-6k. That motor was removed at 217k miles when a lifter roller exploded.

 

I changed my Bonneville's oil (Northstar) whenever the indicator said to because it was 8 quarts of full synthetic-not cheap. I do the same for the 2000 regal, but I don't trust a full change of oil for more than 3500 miles on the 95 regal with the modded L67 and higher fdr. That motor sees way more wide open throttle driving than I want to admit to.

 

That being said, I'll probably send in a sample of the oil on my next oil change if I feel like spending the money.

 

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I love how people think that their opinions are fact. Oil change intervals are purely up to the car owner. If someone wants to change their oil every 400 miles that's their right. If they never change the oil they have their car, that's also their right.

 

This.

 

Just because you've been driving a car for 50 years and think you know best doesn't mean its right. I wouldn't dare go 4-5000 miles between oil changes because I know my oil starts to get pretty dirty around 3000 miles. Its a matter of the owner of the car quit being a lazy fuck and check their oil once in a while. If you don't want to do it every 3k miles, keep and eye on it and change it when it gets really dirty. Testing your oil is bullshit too, if my oil is thick and black, I don't care if it still has protection left, I'm changing it.

 

The ONE thing I will disagree with is the time table. 3 months IS excessive for an oil change if you've only put 500 miles on the car.

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This.

 

Just because you've been driving a car for 50 years and think you know best doesn't mean its right. I wouldn't dare go 4-5000 miles between oil changes because I know my oil starts to get pretty dirty around 3000 miles. Its a matter of the owner of the car quit being a lazy fuck and check their oil once in a while. If you don't want to do it every 3k miles, keep and eye on it and change it when it gets really dirty. Testing your oil is bullshit too, if my oil is thick and black, I don't care if it still has protection left, I'm changing it.

 

The ONE thing I will disagree with is the time table. 3 months IS excessive for an oil change if you've only put 500 miles on the car.

 

I'm with this guy. Even with a good Wix or Purolator PureOne filter, I'm still at under $20 an oil change.

 

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Just because you've been driving a car for 50 years and think you know best doesn't mean its right. I wouldn't dare go 4-5000 miles between oil changes because I know my oil starts to get pretty dirty around 3000 miles. Its a matter of the owner of the car quit being a lazy fuck and check their oil once in a while. If you don't want to do it every 3k miles, keep and eye on it and change it when it gets really dirty. Testing your oil is bullshit too, if my oil is thick and black, I don't care if it still has protection left, I'm changing it.

 

If your oil is doing its job, it'll LOOK dirty after a few hundred miles. You can't tell if oil is effective or causing harm to the engine by its color any more than you can tell if your blood is full of artery-clogging LDL cholesterol simply by looking at its color.

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Well no shit it'll look dirty, mine looks dirty about about 700 miles, but its not like its black. Rather than the almost-clear brown, it gets a dark brown, and by the time my oil change comes around its usually pretty dark and barely see-through.

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Whether you can see through it or not doesn't mean anything either. Manufacturer recommendations and oil life monitors can be trusted. They don't give a rat's ass if you want to blow your money on more frequent oil changes, but they sure as hell don't want to blow their money on warranty repairs so they're not going to recommend an oil change interval that's detrimental to your engine. If anything, they're going to err on the side of caution.

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I never said not to trust those. I'm talking about the post-oil life monitor cars. If I had a car with an oil life monitor I'd follow it too.

 

I don't think I've EVER seen it come on for any of my cars! :lol: On my mom's Jeep I think it's just programmed for every 3k miles because that's about what it does. Yeah she does mostly city driving but none of her other cars have come on that soon. We don't follow it though since we use Mobil 1 in it...

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Testing your oil is bullshit too, if my oil is thick and black, I don't care if it still has protection left, I'm changing it.

The trick is to figure out if the oil's thickness/viscosity is somehow unusual CONSIDERING THE TEMPERATURE of the oil.

Oil sample analysis includes viscosity testing. If the oil REALLY is thick, it's not fit for service, and they'll tell you that in the printed report you receive. Depending on the lab, they may try to contact you by 'phone if the oil is unfit for service. (Some folks--typically fleets--take oil samples without actually changing the oil--they rely on the lab to contact them when the oil is "done".)

 

 

 

 

Years ago, my friend would change oil and then yip and howl about how the old oil "ran out like water"; as if that was some clear sign that the oil was degraded. I told him "The oil you pour in is at room temperature, and it's thick. The oil coming out is at 180 degrees because you've warmed up the engine, OF COURSE it's thin. Put new oil in a pan on the stove, heat it to 180, and see how thick it is." He was a quick study, didn't take more than ten seconds for the truth to sink in.

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I don't think I've EVER seen it come on for any of my cars! :lol: On my mom's Jeep I think it's just programmed for every 3k miles because that's about what it does.

Maybe two weeks ago I was skimming an article in a professional-auto-repair magazine that discussed the oil life monitors. Seems GM used an algorithm that takes into account time, mileage, throttle position (load), idle time, etc.; while some Fords were little more than a "counter" for mileage.

 

If I can find an on-line version of that article, I'll post the link.

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