MonteCarloChick Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 My boyfriend's mom's car (a '96 Corsica with a 3100) has a coolant leak. I've read a lot about this but I need some clarification. I've done a lot of work involving almost every aspect of a car except engine work. If someone could explain how to fix this problem clearly it would be VERY MUCH appreciated. Thanks, Nichole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19Cutlass94 Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Do you know where its leaking from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonteCarloChick Posted October 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Somewhere from the bottom of the engine.. there's fluid everywhere Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SigEpCutlass Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Define everywhere?!? If it's leaking from the lower left side of the engine (aka the side with the belt ), then I'd say it's probably the water pump. The water pump is located behind one of the pulleys, and isn't all that bad to replace from what I understand. If there's any coolant being "thrown" on to the radiator or radiator hoses, it's definately from the acc. belt throwing it on there from the leaking water pump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonteCarloChick Posted October 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 It's coming from the lower right side of the engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19Cutlass94 Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Id look at a leaking thermostat housing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SigEpCutlass Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Id look at a leaking thermostat housing. I'd agree that could be the source if you can see that the coolant is running down the block from behind the manifold on the right side. I'm assuming that the manifolds are the same or similar to my '94 in the fact that they need to be removed to access or change the thermostat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonteCarloChick Posted October 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 This is Nichole's boyfriend posting under her name because I'm too lazy to log in. There's coolant definitely in the oil. It appears to be leaking from somewhere on the driver's side. If you look WAYYYYYYYYYY under the upper intake manifold, you can see coolant on the LIM/block. I've got an upper intake gasket and new thermostat so far since it'll be ripped apart anyways. From what Nichole tells me it's almost always the lower intake manifold gasket that goes, not the upper, which is what a mechanic told me it sounded like. If you guys need more information about where the coolant is collecting, or better descriptions etc... ask away and either Nichole or myself will clarify anything else that's needed to diagnose this problem. Thanks again for the replies, -Brandon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SigEpCutlass Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Ok. Sounds to me like there's more than one problem here (possibly). First and foremost, if there's coolant in the oil...PARK the car. Do not drive it or you risk damaging the engine. Any idea how long it's been like that? Nichole is correct in that the LIM gasket is usually what goes. However, you should replace the upper intake gasket while you're at it. Fix the intake gaskets first, and then see if you still have coolant leaking from other areas after you put the engine back together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mach 5 Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 It could be and intake and/or cylinder head gasket. Remove one of the spark plugs and see if its wet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcusa Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 There's coolant definitely in the oil. Don't drive another inch. And I hope you've got money, that ain't gonna be cheap. Any oil in the coolant? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonteCarloChick Posted October 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Mike, Thanks for the quick reply... There's been a leak SOMEWHERE, I'd say for AT LEAST 4 years. This is my parents car, they did the maintenance (or lack therof). They knew about the head gasket and still choose to drive it. I'm going to try to get it parked today so Nichole and I can start tearing it apart. As a ,matter of fact, my mother drove the car home after a low oil light came on. Turned out the oil sensor blew oil through the terminals. That was fixed Sunday. Now I'd like to get this head gasket done because they'll never do it. If its not too much of a pain, I'll do the upper and lower IM gaskets, and I'll check the plugs as soon as the car gets home, thanks for the tip on the plugs Mach 5. I'll post an update in a few hours......... There's coolant definitely in the oil. Don't drive another inch. And I hope you've got money, that ain't gonna be cheap. Any oil in the coolant? Another inch? Try a 20 minute drive. My parents suck with cars.......... I told them the engine will end up seizing.. do they listen? No. Just ask Nichole......... Gaskets shouldn't be more than $10-$20 for the upper and lower. Thermostat? $8 It'll be cheap. We're doing the labor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SigEpCutlass Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Mike, Thanks for the quick reply... There's been a leak SOMEWHERE, I'd say for AT LEAST 4 years. This is my parents car, they did the maintenance (or lack therof). They knew about the head gasket and still choose to drive it. I'm going to try to get it parked today so Nichole and I can start tearing it apart. As a ,matter of fact, my mother drove the car home after a low oil light came on. Turned out the oil sensor blew oil through the terminals. That was fixed Sunday. Now I'd like to get this head gasket done because they'll never do it. If its not too much of a pain, I'll do the upper and lower IM gaskets, and I'll check the plugs as soon as the car gets home, thanks for the tip on the plugs Mach 5. I'll post an update in a few hours......... There's coolant definitely in the oil. Don't drive another inch. And I hope you've got money, that ain't gonna be cheap. Any oil in the coolant? Another inch? Try a 20 minute drive. My parents suck with cars.......... I told them the engine will end up seizing.. do they listen? No. Just ask Nichole......... Gaskets shouldn't be more than $10-$20 for the upper and lower. Thermostat? $8 It'll be cheap. We're doing the labor. NP! Has there been a coolant leak for 4 years on the driver's side...or has there been a problem with the coolant leaking into the engine for 4 years? If it's the latter...damn I'm suprised it's still running. I don't know about the headgasket needing replacement. You might want to ask Brian P about that. He's pretty knowledgeable about the 3100 engines. I would start with planning on replacing the LIM & UIM gaskets. That alone will probably take you guys anywhere from 4-10 hours. If it doesn't need a headgasket, put the back together and use an engine flush to get all the milky coolant garbage out of the engine. After that I would give it an oil change. Run it for a bit, and then check it to make sure the gaskets sealed correctly (aka no milky residues etc.). I would perform the next oil change after that early, & then it should be back to business as usual. BTW...I think the gaskets are going to be more than $20 for both...try closer to $40. Make sure you get the newer gaskets with the reinforcements for the coolant passages. There have been some posts showing the comparison between the old and new gaskets & felpro's in the past, so they should show up in a search if you need it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19Cutlass94 Posted October 9, 2006 Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Try more like $50 for the upper and lower gaskets. And while your there, you might as well replace the dist. o-ring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonteCarloChick Posted October 9, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2006 Mike, there's only been a coolant leak for about 4 years. Coolant in the oil, I'd guess to be about 6 months since I first spotted it in the oil. I took a few crappy camera phone pictures which I'll have Nichole post tonight since I lack patience learning this new fangled technology. All the pictures are on the driver's side, each was taken at different points along where the LIM meets the block. I think there's a shot or two showing where the head meets the block, and they look solid to me. If you look closely, you should be able to see the coolant puddles in the pictures. The passenger side looks like any normal daily driver, greasy, but no signs of coolant. And I was wrong about the cost of the gaskets. The UIM gasket was $4. The thermostat was $8. The LIM gasket ranges between $40-$80, depending on the heads. And I'm already planning on an oil change 1 week after this is done, then a few more in between, depending on how the oil looks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJansen658 Posted October 10, 2006 Report Share Posted October 10, 2006 IT IS THE LIM GASKET!!!! I would bet anything it is the LIM gasket. Thats all that ever goes on these engines. I have been a certified mechanic for 8 years... whenever anyone brings in a car for oil in the coolant on a 3.1/3100 it is the LIM gasket. ALWAYS. I have not once in 8 years done a head gasket on a 3.1/3100. Its always the intake. If you look down on the right side of the engine by the distributor oil pump drive plug and there is coolant on top of the block next to it, ITS THE LIM. This will also USUALLY put coolant into the oil as well. Replace the oil pump drive o-ring as 19cutlass94 suggested....fel-pro # 70800 You will be taking apart the valve covers, replace their gaskets too.... fel-pro # VS50442R The UIM Gasket.... return yours, it will come in the package with the LIM gasket The LIM gasket..... there are 2 for the 3100's One is for the first design with steel pushrod guides under the valve cover. It is fel-pro #MS95536. The other is for the second design with pushrod guides formed into the gasket itself. It is fel-pro #MS90562. You can tell the two apart easily by opening the oil cap and looking at the rocker arms with a light. The first design engine uses ball pivots. The second design engine uses fulcrum pivot with bearings. Buy 1qt. of Gunk motor flush, 8qts. Oil, 1gal. undilluted coolant, and 2 oil filters. The only torque specs you really need are for the rockers, the LIM, and the valve covers. They are: Rockers 1st design 18ft lbs. Rockers 2nd design 89in. lbs. + 30 degrees LIM Step 1 62in lbs. (tighten the vertical bolts first) LIM Step 2 115in. lbs. (tighten the vertical bolts first) Valve Covers 89in. lbs. The article regarding fel-pro gaskets can be found here: http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3102/is_6_124/ai_n14890677 A word of advice when reassembling the LIM... once you have the bolts to 115in. lbs. all the way around... tighten ONLY THE DIAGONAL bolts another 60 degrees. I read a TSB regarding this some years ago, suggesting another 60 degrees will aid in sealing ability and gasket lifespan. I always do this, and I am not sure if it really helps, but it doesn't hurt, and I've never had a LIM gasket leak after I was done with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonteCarloChick Posted October 11, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 ^^ Thanks! We just got the engine pretty much apart tonight and I must say, wow. Milky sludge EVERYWHERE. There was about a 1/2 inch just caked inside of the valve covers and basically everywhere else. Also, it looks like someone tried to repair the seal with silicone instead of actually fixing the gasket issue. What a mess. I took some phone pics and will try to get some digital ones tomorrow because I've never seen anything like this in my life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19Cutlass94 Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 Thats absolutly horrible! I wonder how much longer shes gonna last... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GP1138 Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 Holy God that's amazing! It makes me sick looking at that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOHCRagtopguy Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 That poor engine! That series of engines is known for poor LIM gaskets. Good luck with the job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skiiirt Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 You should look for someone who can run the snap-on engine cleaner through your engine. Completely cleans that shit out. Thats disgusting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Regal Limited Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 and good lord I shit my pants..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonteCarloChick Posted October 11, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 You should look for someone who can run the snap-on engine cleaner through your engine. Completely cleans that shit out. Thats disgusting! I must note.. this is not mine.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJansen658 Posted October 11, 2006 Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 Nah... thats not that bad.... typical on an engine thats been driven with a LIM leak. Run the engine flush thru it, and change the oil again... now that the engine has no more coolant getting into it, it will burn off what remains over the next few hundred miles. Thats absolutly horrible! I wonder how much longer shes gonna last... Mine looked like that 40,000miles ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonteCarloChick Posted October 11, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 The boyfriend again- I doubt my parents will learn this lesson, but hopefully this helps someone on here learn what a little preventative maintenance, and using the RIGHT coolant will help you avoid. My parents couldn't read DEX COOL COOLANT ONLY, and decided green antifreeze was just fine. I'm sure a lot of that sludge is from the mixing of wrong coolants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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