Trans Questions

[f_399]

My trans is still ok but I am not sure if its in perfect condition.

 

shifting from 1st- 2nd is always rough but from 2-3 or 3-4 its smooth

 

is this a bad sign? The guys in the service shop told me the fluid is getting dirty and i needed to flush (is this the best way to do it?) for about $90.

 

What preventive maintenance can I do?

 

I usually drive hard but not from a stop.

 

I go fast in the high way and usually down shfting from 3-2 or 4-3 or 4-2.

 

Any tips?

[Guest Gp crazy]

YEP! look for the VAC Line form motor to the tranny make sure it's in good contition. ie NO CRACK'S if it's good look at the VAC modual (spelling is wrong ) look for leak's around it and also look for fluid around the base if there is fluid around it it may be bad! also if the T\V cable is sticking it may cause this also !

just a thought jeff b

[THe_DeTAiL3R]

Changing tranny fluid (dropping the pan) is always a good idea, especially if you haven't done it since you've owned the car.

 

Also could be the transmission vaccuum modulator.. if its bad (plugging the vaccuum harder than it should) it will cause hard shift especially 1-2, 2-1, R-D..

[DaveFromColorado]

the flush is always the best way to go tho, more effective then droppin' the pan and replacin' it that way.

 

--Dave

[PaPaPooh]

the flush is always the best way to go tho, more effective then droppin' the pan and replacin' it that way.

 

--Dave

 

flushing is a waste of time and money

 

a pan drop will be fine

if you are still worried about it being contaminated drop the pan again in 5000 or so miles and spend less money than a full flush

 

second pan drop will help with getting rid of the contaminets

 

on a side note i hope to soon have a list of things to look for when you drop the pan to see if you need a full overhaul of the trans

this will be on my site

 

but for now if you want a break down of a 4T60 trans

 

Click Here

 

Good Luck

 

P.S. there are good suggestions here look at those then move on to the fluid service

[93CutlassSupreme]

the flush is always the best way to go tho, more effective then droppin' the pan and replacin' it that way.

 

--Dave

 

flushing is a waste of time and money

 

a pan drop will be fine

if you are still worried about it being contaminated drop the pan again in 5000 or so miles and spend less money than a full flush

 

second pan drop will help with getting rid of the contaminets

 

 

i agree 100%

 

you really don't need to drop the pan a second time, you will get most of the fluid out the first time, and plus you'll have a new filter

[DaveFromColorado]

how is flushing the fluid a waste of time, it will replace all the fluid, instead of just some of the fluid.

 

... I could go on and on for hours about problems in manufacturing and how those "problems" end up in the filter, so basing whether or not your going to rebuild your trans because of what's in your filter is crap and a waste of time.

 

If you want to pick it apart, dropping the pan and then running the car and droping the pan again is even more of a waste of time and money, if you are really interested in a clean trans, then you can drop the pan, replace the fluid and the filter, top off the trans, because that's all you'll be doing, is topping it off, not really refilling it, and then take it out to have it flushed, that would be the best way to do it.

 

Whenever doing this (flushing, or dropping the pan) replace the fluid with Type F fliud instead of Mercon/Dextron III you'll notice an all 'round tighter transmission.

 

--Dave

[91oldscutlass]

Flushing gets the fluid out of the converter too...so why would a flush be a waste of time?? I mean if you want to get all the shit out of the trans that is the way to go.

[gp90se]

Fluid every 30k, filter every 60k.

 

Dropping the pan will get 75% of the fluid out, and you can clean the magnet inside the pan and change the filter.

 

A fluid exchange will change 99-100% of the fluid, including the torque converter and clean out the tranny cooler.

 

If you have never changed the filter before and/or do not know of often the fluid has been changed, go have a fluid exchange done on the car, THEN drop the pan and reuse the fluid, that way you get everything.

 

Also, after a fluid change of any kind, throw in a bottle of Lucas tranny fix even if your tranny is working fine, it will help keep everything in the tranny clean and the gaskets from drying out.

 

Also, I cant stress enough how much longer your tranny will last with a 2ed (or 3ed on some cars) can help. the colder you can keep ya tranny fluid the better.

 

-Jeff

[PaPaPooh]

how is flushing the fluid a waste of time, it will replace all the fluid, instead of just some of the fluid.

 

... I could go on and on for hours about problems in manufacturing and how those "problems" end up in the filter, so basing whether or not your going to rebuild your trans because of what's in your filter is crap and a waste of time.

 

If you want to pick it apart, dropping the pan and then running the car and droping the pan again is even more of a waste of time and money, if you are really interested in a clean trans, then you can drop the pan, replace the fluid and the filter, top off the trans, because that's all you'll be doing, is topping it off, not really refilling it, and then take it out to have it flushed, that would be the best way to do it.

 

Whenever doing this (flushing, or dropping the pan) replace the fluid with Type F fliud instead of Mercon/Dextron III you'll notice an all 'round tighter transmission.

 

--Dave

 

you know why dextron/mercon is used in these transmissions?

 

i well know why and i would hope you know if you are suggesting the type f P/S fluid for ford?

 

fluid flush waste of time

 

1) you never get the filter changed

2) you don't see what is in the pan if you think the trans is acting funny

3) dumbass error at quick lube places that have the money to own a trans flusher (worker hooking it up wrong and flushing it the wrong way)

 

oh and dave i would like to know why they use dextron/mercon in these transmissions?

[DaveFromColorado]

.. if you'd like to know the HONEST truth as to why Dex-3/Merc is used is because it has less friction modifiers allowing the transmission clutch packs to slip more and absorb more energy (horsepower/torque) keeping the differental, CV axels, Bearings, Tires so on and so fourth lasting longer, where as the type F fluid has more* friction modifiers (usually Zinc if you want to know the actual ingerdent) creating tighter clutches, Ford uses this because they use smaller clutch packs with less clutches per gear ratio then GM does, meaning they need it.

 

want to know more?

 

--Dave.

 

p.s. if those jiffy lube guys mess up your transmission, by flushing it the wrong way, wich cannot happen because they use the transmissions internal pump, not some pump on the machine but still if they do mess it up they will simply get you a new transmission.

 

I'd like to add a few things that I didn't think of a few moments ago - so here I'm to edit my post..

 

do you know why the tran's often stop shifting right, or they have major problems right after you change the fluid? I can answer this question for you. When you have your old fluid in the transmission, and it heats up and gets sheered enough in the TC it starts to break down and turn to varnish, this varnish sticks in the bores of the valve body and once you put in the new fluid with all the extra detergents it will wash the varnish away and now you have clearences that are way* too large to hold the fluid properly, causing these slipping problems, and then quick failure. mind you, this is one of the typical causes, NOT the only cause.

 

and since I see your qualifications there, I'd like to point out that I've already got my AAS degree in Automotive Mechanics Technology.

 

--Dave.

[Slade901]

For me, if I have a well maintained transmission, I would not let anyone reverse flush the transmission fluid. I would accept regular flushing in the direction of the fluid flow.

 

If the transmission was not serviced properly. I would only drop the transmission pan and put new transmission fluid filter. I would not drain the torque converter if it is has a drain plug. Fill the transmission with new fluid and top it off. After a year, I would just drop the transmission pan again and put new transmission fluid filter again and top it off. I want it to gradually clean if any varnish (transmission fluid breakdown) has accumulated .

[PaPaPooh]

Ford uses this because they use smaller clutch packs with less clutches per gear ratio then GM does, meaning they need it.

 

want to know more?

 

--Dave.

 

not some pump on the machine but still if they do mess it up they will simply get you a new transmission.

 

 

and since I see your qualifications there, I'd like to point out that I've already got my AAS degree in Automotive Mechanics Technology.

 

--Dave.

 

wrong about ford the reason they use the add modifyers is becaus the clutch pack material does not have it. size has nothing to do with it

 

and who wants the head ache of fighting to get a new trans?

 

AAS in auto don't mean anything to me when it comes to you being a master mechanic and talking about transmissions

when you become a trans tech i can see you making logical suggestions

my qualifications are more than the sig says

 

P.S. why do all techs that i have seen use dextron/mercon if type F is so good for your trans

 

could it be because the buy the overhaul kits that have the friction modifyers allready in the friction material?

and

 

ATF Type F Fluid is a premium quality Ford approved fluid described by their specification M2C33-F.This fluid is recommended for all pre 1979 model Ford build automatic transmissions regardless of age. It is recommended for use in selected imported automatic transmissions or wherever a fluid meeting Ford's specification M2C33-F is required. It should not be used in any transmission calling for DEXRON III, DEXRON 11, MERCON, Ford fluids such as M2C166-H or M2C138-CJ Fluids. ATF Type F Fluid is also approved for Detroit Diesel Allison C-3 applications

 

Edit: i have made my point and shown what they say about type F fluid and im done arguing my point

 

have a nice day

[DaveFromColorado]

so you can throw part numbers and technical crap directly from a book is one way and try to make yourself look real good, and it's also a real easy way to try to confuse everyone.

 

All the Tec's that I know use type F in their transmissions, there's a couple trani shops out here that use nothing but Type F trans fluid, and why is that you ask, well perhaps it's because the fluid itself has all the same properties as the Mercon/Dextron III with the exception of the extra friction modifiers, so maybe it's because the extra friction modifiers improve trans life by not allowing as much slippage in the transmissions. You start going off by insulting my degree and such, but remember you're still a student, I have been thru the classes already, I've been working in the field for the past 4 years (two years of which at the same shop where I've rebuilt more TH350's and 700R4's then I care to ever see again in my lifetime)

 

so perhaps you can answer this question, why would you not use type F in a Dex-2/Dex-3 transmission? you threw part numbers at us, and verified that the only difference is the friction modifiers, to me that sounds pretty uneducated and not even worth my time to post this.

 

as for the clutch pack size difference, this was something I got directly from FORD when I asked them why it is they use more modifiers in their older transmissions' fluid.

 

as for those of you who are wondering, whenever you get a B&M Trans Kit, it suggests using either Type F, or Trick SHift Trans fluid in ALL transmissions, but Trick-Shift is only Type F with more detergents and blue dye instead of red dye (looks like smurf blood on the ground) so if it's so bad to run type F why does a Major company suggest using this? why is it that transmissions I've worked on years ago running type F that orignially came with Dex-3 are still shifting smoothly and showing no problems?

 

I think you had better do some real world research rather then pulling figures from a book and asking a couple people what they think of it next time before you post, otherwise you're just going to look like you don't really know what you are talking about..

 

--Dave.

[DaveFromColorado]

I'd like to take this moment, to everyone who read my posting in here that i had it backwards with the friction modified fluid/non modified fluid, DEX-3 is modified to allow it to slip more (same thing with posi lube used in the rear end to keep it from "chattering") and Type F is nonmodified fluid not promoting the extra slippage making firmer shifts.

 

Please see "Transmission Fluid Facts" posted in this section for more information, I took it directly from the book we used at my school when I was earning my AAS degree.

 

 

Again, sorry about the confusion.

--Dave.

[93CutlassSupreme]

i dropped the pan on my car because i wanted a new filter, and i knew i'd get the majority of the old fluid out, which i did, according to gm specs on the capicity of my trans.

 

to me, flushing your trans seems like changing your oil without changing the oil filter