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Well I cant wait any longer for you guys. 23.5 years is a bit long to make a guy hang on. So I just went ahead and got it myself.

Good day, I have been a W body enthusiast since high school 04. In my student parking lot, we had a 93 Gran prix, 94 olds cutlass supreme, 94 cavalier z24, 95 monte, and my lumina z34. These cars were everywhere! My first car was a 94 lumina z34 (still have it). In 2012 I put a 4.9 PFI in it and it is almost complete. I just need to replace the rear suspension and odds and ends. I have a 99 Monte (needs some work), and I just picked up a decent (needs some work) Cutlass supreme. I am buying a new top for the cutlass on Friday. I want to get black canvass instead of the white (the car has black leather interior). They come in black, grey, white, red. What do you all think would be the best color? Just curious. Very few of these ole buggies still around (at least in my area). I thought I would join the forum to see what you all are up to (I feel very late to the party). I already have seen some super nice examples of these cars (nice job everyone!). Ill post more as spring hits and I can get them out, and work on them more. Also, not adverse to loading them up on the trailer for any meets that might happen. Thank you! Hope you all have a wonderful day!

Welcome! I think black top will look great on it. Better late than never! Not as bustling as it was back in the day, but there's a few of us W-body old timers left. I wouldn't mind seeing pics of the 4.9L in a W-body.

anyways, welcome to the site.

Wow, that's awesome!

UPDATE: the car is going to the mechanic on 2/23 for this job. It will be going to a chevy dealer whose mechanic has decades of experience which is exactly what I was looking for. This mechanic is semi-retired and picks & chooses the jobs he wants to do. When he learned I'm the original and 4th owner he took the job. I was asked to supply all the parts which I think I will need. Included with these parts will be a new EGR valve and a new Low Coolant Sensor (due to the coolant being partially drained). I made a copy of Gnat's photo so thanks again for this. I will be seeing how the mechanic feels about just going the RTV route in lieu of pulling the rear head. Not only will the job be alot cheaper, I'd really prefer not opening that Pandora's box of potential additional issues if the head needs to be taken off.

Damn, that's a rare one!

Thanks all for this. As of the moment the car is in storage do it will be a while before I can check it out, but I will say I get more & more confident this will be the cause. It has been happening for a long time. Form the day I bought this car in Oct., 1994, I always wondered where a quart of oil was going every 1000 miles or so. My money is on this as pictured above, it was probably badly sealed to begin with. And these things don't get better, only worse. I went in and checked my 2020 repair bills from when I had the intake manifold gaskets replaced. The mechanic also replaced the gasket for the part 10130955 as you see in the photo but no mention is made on whether the distributor plug seal was addressed so I am going to assume it was not. While it's a shame all that work that was done to the motor back then would have to be re-done just to get at what needs to be repaired, so be it. Even if I decide to get the rear head pulled to replace the O-ring rather than trying my luck with sealant, that's still way better than having the entire motor pulled. I might as well go the whole 9 yards and have both head gaskets replaced for a one and done job. I should be getting the car out of storage within the next few weeks, I'll keep all posted on how things progress, and thanks again, much appreciated!

You're in the right place because we love our W-bodies here. Welcome!

The thought here was that you don't drive your W's in the winter.

Got the fuel line disconnected and fuel can ready to go but no go on the fuel pump. Do I have it wrong here? The car has been sitting for 6 weeks so the battery may be weak but radio turns on. Edit nevermind I'm an idiot i see the number on bottom of relay and i had it wrong Works like a charm thanks all

I wanna see pictures of the Gran Prix, never seen one before! /s Welcome!

Does the pump run? If it does, unhook a fuel line under the hood and jump the fuel pump relay.

You never know... It could very well be! Funny story about stuff like that....My parents had a mid 70s silver Avion camper when I was a kid that I absolutely loved. It was sold to someone from out of province in very early 2000, supposedly to be used for parts to repair an identical unit that had a partially collapse on it, but was in better shape interior wise. I ended up coming across an identical unit for sale a couple years ago on Facebook marketplace, and while checking out the pictures, out of all things the stereo is what caught my eye. Sure as shit, it was our old camper. Further proven when my parents came across a draft of the bill of sale that had the matching serial number. Part of me just about ran out and bought it....but I passed as the layout really wouldn't work for my family.

That's how I'm looking at it. I wouldn't have not bought the Regal, or insisted on paying any less for it if there was a disconnected and neatly stored amp wire running back to the trunk, everything else being equal. My thought is that the target buyer for that car is the type of person to be a member here, and is likely to be relatively well versed in them to where something like that wouldn't make a difference in either case. It's not a super low mileage museum piece where I feel something like that would make a difference. If anything, that car being "The Car" of these forums makes it more desirable, but that's just me.

If it were me I'd pull it... but I also wouldn't worry too much about seeing it neatly tied up and disconnected at both ends if I were a buyer. It was the style at the time to run aftermarket stereos in nearly everything, so I consider it to be remanent of a former, period correct modification.

I mean...those uncoated rotors often flash rust after a single wash and start looking pretty shabby in very short order, especially if the car has the 5 spokes or some other wheel that shows much of the brakes. Definitely won't need protection from salt, but as the coated ones do decently well against that, I can see them lasting forever on a southern car.

I'm somewhat surprised that where you are in Tennessee that you have to even concern yourself about this. Now if you lived up here.......well, that's a different matter.

A maroon or dark green GS, tan interior and tinted windows with "Buick" mud flaps hits a 99-04ish nostalgia spot. Would still have to have those logo puddle lights though.

My grandparents had a 04 Regal GS with a "supercharged" emblem on the trunk lid. If I recall it was on the driver side.

GM if you can get them, anchor would be last resort. I just ordered a complete set of DEA mounts a couple days ago ago for my Lumina.

Welcome!

UPDATE - I believe I may have found a shop with a mechanic having the experience to have worked on these motors that will do the job. My first hunch was to go to a Chevy dealership as the Lumina had these motors as well, those Z-34's you almost never see (?). As soon as they found out I was in no rush to get the car back, they were more open to the idea of working on it. I guess they thought I wanted it done yesterday. Not the case, anytime between now and July 22 will do........ Stay tuned

You are correct on that point, I will be checking my local independent shops to see if they want the job. Not everyone wants to work on these. The first thing I will hear is the job would cost more than the car is worth. I bought this car new in 1994. I gave it to my dad in 2012 who in turn sold it to my brother in 2018. My brother did a swell job of running it into the ground, but when my dad passed away 1/2020 my brother didn't want the car anymore and showed up at my house a month or so later and handed me the keys. That makes me the 1st and 4th owner. There is no mechanic on this earth that's going to be successful in convincing me that any job needed to be done on this car will exceed its value. I watched a 24 minute video earlier today on how to do this job. II won't be doing it as a result of watching it. These videos are valuable in that respect as well.

Wow, you've almost had that car as long as I've had my 89 Cutlass! Can't remember if I got mine in late 93 or early 94. Yes, that seal goes bad in all of them. Not if, but when. Rear main seal is rare. Oil pump drive O-rings going bad I'd say is 100% rate. If you were going to DIY it, I'd say don't worry about pulling the rear head. I owned my 94 for 12-years and my fudge-fix lasted for most of that time up to the day I sold the car. If you're having a shop do it, I imagine the intake manifold R&R itself isn't cheap, so I can understand wanting to do the head gaskets at the same time so as not to have to pay for a repeat job in the future. However, head gaskets on a DOHC V-engine sounds like it could be quite expensive labor-wise.

I've ground the top ridge of the pump drive down slightly to allow for more room to work, then use a distributer gasket for a Lumina van with a 3.1, just give it a cut and slather it in RTV, seems to work well. and I'll be damned if I'm pulling a head just for that.

It's in the valley right by where the transmission and engine block are joined together. Oil will pool around the distributor plug (also called "oil pump drive") and run down the side right where the transmission mates to the block so where it drips on the ground looks very much like a rear main seal. An O-ring goes bad on it allowing it to leak. Shine a flashlight down there, and if there's oil pooled in that area, that's your culprit. Unfortunately, yes, it's blocked by the rear head. What most people do is lift it up as high as possible and clean it and the block as well as possible. Some sandwich a thin O-ring under it, others RTV it. My memory is hazy, but I think I may have done both. On my pic, high pressure oil-resistant RTV is the stuff kind of squishing out from under it. It's dirty because this was many years later, but it worked great. Official GM procedure is to pull the rear head, but that's way, way too much trouble.

I bought some decades ago to do the same thing, but never got around to it. I was going to try to mod them for 6.5" speakers and needed a plan for how to mod the buckets, but in the modern day, it would make more sense to 3D print some custom ones rather than mod the OEM ones as I wanted to use the OEM grilles which are flat against the trim panel. I can't find them at the moment or I'd snap a pic. As for prewired, my 89 wasn't prewired, but different years might do things differently.

I think the mounts will fit the doors, but I don't know that they'll fit under the door panels. 95-96 used 5.25" in these angled enclosure pod things that stick out quite a bit while 88-92 used 4x6's on a flat plate.

There are various designs...plastic or steel.......seeing as you don't intend on getting into this sort of repair again I'd suggest just picking up the plastic set, you should be able to find them at Harbor Freight. The inlet (pressure side) is 3/8 as for a gas can..really up to you..pick up a pair of containers that will hold a total of 15 gals?

This is the only device that will separate the fuel line from the rail.... there is another method you might try.... raise the car up high enough to get under comfortably & disconnect the fuel filter from the fuel line (one end of the filter makes used of threaded connection , the other end is the same ac/fuel line quick disconnect slip-on connection). Once again run a length of hose long enough to clear the car & fill a gas container to drain the tank.

The fuel lines that feed the fuel rail are not screw on nut fittings, both the pressure & the return are disconnected with a set of fuel line/ac disconnect tools. The pressure line is near the centre at the back of the engine. One pulls off the engine cover & you'll see the fuel rail. Once you've disconnected the line you'll need a lengthy section of garden hose to slip over the fuel line end & tape it up to prevent any leaking & feed it into a container size of your choosing. Now you can bypass the relay to power up the fuel pump to drain the tank.

there should be a loose red wire near the relay jump that to the positive post and it should turn the fuel pump on

Hi guys, I'm still alive and well and still have dome light switches! The site used to send me an email when someone posted on this thread, not sure if that doesn't work anymore? My direct email is mezz@benris.com if anyone else is still looking or switches.

Spammer......

not even a difference ABS/non abs on the gen1 front knuckles. the sensor is separate of the wheel hub - why gm couldn't have continued this into the later cars is beyond me. buy whichever brand you determine to be the highest quality or fits within your budget

Here is info for the the swap based on my own experience of swapping my 88 cutlass w-body. 3800 swap w-body From 98/99 Monte Carlo z34/lumina LTZ with 3.8NA Needed - power steering lines (buy new) - Heater hoses (buy new) - Exhaust downpipe (or have one made) - AC system - all lines/parts from the engine bay (compressors can be from the gtp too) Best to have from the Monte Carlo/lumina but not mandatory - engine bay wiring harness - Cv shafts (buy new if you don’t have them) From gtp donor - motor - Trans - Trans cooler lines - rad hoses - Motor mounts - Cv shafts - PCM - Engine bay wiring harness Notes: cv shafts if using an HD trans you need to use the gtp passenger inner with the 1st Gen shaft and outer joint. If you get them from the Monte you can use the stock Monte drivers side. Wiring: if you can’t find the Monte Carlo harness you can use the gtp harnesss, and merge it into the 1st Gen c100 connector. With the Monte harness it comes with the c100 you just need to remove a few pins around and overall much easier but can be hard to find. You’ll need the GM service manuals for your donor harness and your original car to match the c100 connector. If using a Monte harness you will probably want to add the BBV wiring. This will also convert the car to obd2 PCM: you will need to get the vats/security removed(it’s possible it won’t be an issue but be aware it probably will be) and probably want to remove a few other codes. Rad: you could use your original, but the donor gtp rad will be bigger and fits into the chassis. I’d say it’s recommended but not 100% necessary.

What they liked the best: The brakes. What folks complain about the most on this site: The brakes. I've said it before, I'll say it again: The biggest problem with Gen 1 brakes is not the brakes per se, it's the brake booster.

"Automatic shoulder belts"

I think youd have to do it by generation, as there are some significant changes by generation as well as intent (when you get to the later years there was more of a focus on handling handling vs the earlier focus on comfort handling). In addition, its important to consider that skidpad Gs do not equal handling. Ive driven race cars that would do an epic skidpad number but are so ill handling in transition/under braking/whatever, that they are virtually undriveable. I have the most experience with 1st gen w-bodies, and my vote there would be for the FE3 level Grand Prix coupe with the 245 wide tires. Though I suspect/wonder if the 1990 olds international with FE3 and the quad 4 would be the ultimate iteration for handling. Ive never driven one (almost nobody has) so I cant say definitively, hence my mention above of the 245 tire equipped GP. For gen 1.5, Im not sure. For the last generation, its most likely the 2008 GP GXP. The fact they fitted reverse stagger tires (and engineered the suspension to utilize this setup) tells me someone understood how to make an FWD car handle.

That is interesting how the sun visors disintegrated but yet the headliner was ok. My armrests are still soft and pliable, I just had to really clean them due to the years of elbows and forearms constantly touching them. They were pretty dark and black. I used a gentle mixture of Dawn soap and warm water and just gently rubbed them with a lint free cloth until the red started to appear. My headliner and sun visors are perfect in this car thankfully. The STE...not so much. The California desert pretty much baked it's interior. I'm SO THANKFUL that the International has such a nice interior. It's part of the reason why it's a 1 of 1 car. I'm actually restoring the front seats in it right now. The side bolster on the driver's seat is worn out. I'll post pics soon. I have all the hard pieces figured out and collected on the STE. It will be pricey though but I'll do a little at a time. The rear seat headrests and upper top portion of the seat will need to be reupholstered. The front seats are in great condition and just need to be deep cleaned. Same goes for the carpet. Got a new dash pad and found some really nice door panels with perfect door panels. I posted in my thread about all these parts being found. The biggest win was finding a perfect set of door speaker grills and the lenses for the door lamps. Took me years to find those! The original door armrests and the ones I pulled from a junkyard STE...again, not sticky or gooey at all. Pliable and very nice with no cracking or discoloration. I really lucked out there.

Like the title says, I am a new member now, but I was a fairly regular member here around 15-20 years ago. My screen name at that time was Regal_GS_1989. I originally owned an 89 Regal GS coupe, a 92 Cutlass International Coupe, and finally a 2000 Regal Sedan. Life got busy, I stopped posting regularly, and the 2000 was sold off about 10 years ago for something newer and more family friendly. Time has marched on, and I am now in a position where I have the time and resources to be able to own a “weekend” vehicle. As luck, or possibly fate would have it, this beauty quite literally fell into my lap at the perfect moment… A 92 Regal GS Coupe. Black, Grey leather interior, low milage, One owner, garage kept its entire life, ordered new with every option box checked off…save for the sunroof. It’s truly worthy of the term survivor, and it’s exactly how I would have ordered one myself back in the day. Gotta say…it feels sort of strange to be back here posting again about a 1st gen coupe…but I can get used to that I am also surprised at how many screen names I still recognize as well!

any '96-03 3400 will drop right in with the 1st gen OBD2 harness. You will have the easiest time with a '97 system (harness and PCM), I'd go with that. A '96 system would work as well (though it's less tunable should you go that route), but with either setup you go with, grab a PCM from a '96-97 Venture/Montana/Silhouette.

keep it simple and just bolt in the 3400 its less power than the TDC but less weight too! I would just use the stock tranny to keep cost down. you will need the front pass. side block mount from a 3100 equipped w-body because the bolt holes are in different spots, at least just on that spot of the block. use a coolant temp sensor from the 3400 (3-wire ) and wire up the temp guage to it insead of the back head cause the 3400 has no hole for the sensor. you will also need a throttle cable and exhaust manifolds for a 3100 w-body. Most people use the 3.1 injectors and harness when they do the swap untill they go to tune it. stay away from the '04+ 3400's in the equinox (I beleave it is) they have a plenum that faces the opposite way and a different crank sensor pick up on the crank that will not work with your 3.1 ecm. that is all that is comming to mind right now.

The '93 3100 used the exact same ECM as the 94-95 models.

Well i tryed a new ECM last night and it worked fine. It stood on for 30min and that was with shutting it off twice in between. The cars idle is even smoother than before now. In a little bit im going to drive around and test it out so ill let you guys know how it goes. I think im still going to test that fuel pressure thing out though. Just to make sure...

LOL I drove a quad 4 Grand prix. it was actually pretty quick. That was one of the VERY few quad 4 w-bodies i have seen. I would like to get my hands on one of thoes. Turbo Quad 4 GTP. i think the one i drove was a 1992 or a 1993 (not sure on the year anymore). it was blue (Very nice condition). It seemed quicker then i bet it actually was. I assume that maybe due to gear ratios being lower so it has more off the line get-up. RedZ

Being it's an I series, that should be the HO quad 4, even rarer!

That's no shit! That'd be a keeper!