badprix Posted December 11, 2002 Report Share Posted December 11, 2002 My cousin recently purchased a 1993 Buick Regal with the 3.8 or would it be 3800? I havnt looked under the hood yet and he says its a 3800. (of course he is the epitome of ricer) but I was wondering if his car would stomp mine or not. his car can spin the hell out of the tires Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
90lumina3.1 Posted December 11, 2002 Report Share Posted December 11, 2002 i would think it would be the 3.8, not the 3800, but who knows Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBuick Posted December 11, 2002 Report Share Posted December 11, 2002 It is a 3800 series 1 and yes it will beat you. - Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badprix Posted December 11, 2002 Author Report Share Posted December 11, 2002 lol, ty for the blunt answer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBuick Posted December 11, 2002 Report Share Posted December 11, 2002 hmmm...why did that get posted twice..?? -T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NORBI Posted December 11, 2002 Report Share Posted December 11, 2002 Isn a 3800 same as 3.8 isnt the displacement the same? And i drove a gen 1 3800 and they are pretty quick on start i took my friends 96 Mustang Gt Convertible on the start in 89 Oldsmobile Delta 88 with 3800 on. And yes they are much quicker then 3.1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBuick Posted December 11, 2002 Report Share Posted December 11, 2002 Same displacement, but the 3.8 is a rear wheel drive motor. 3800 is front wheel drive. 86 (I believe)-89 had a series 1 non-TPI with 165hp and 220tq 90-94/95 had series 1 TPI with 170hp and 225tq 95/96-pres has series 2 tpi with 200-205hp and 230tq and then there are the supercharged motors: 92-93 205hp/265tq 93-96 225hp/270 (275?)tq 97-pres 240hp/280tq -T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NORBI Posted December 11, 2002 Report Share Posted December 11, 2002 92-93 205hp/265tq 93-96 225hp/270 (275?)tq 97-pres 240hp/280tq Speaking of 92-93 how fast are those and is it hard to modify then and possible to drop one in a 88 CS with 2.8? same question for 93-96 because 97 and up i know a lot about those but earier ones i know nothing about them and was thinking maybe once put one in my CS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
91GranSport Posted December 11, 2002 Report Share Posted December 11, 2002 Thanks for the engine info Tom, I'm glad to hear someone knows a lot about Buick motors! But nowadays, almost every GM platform has a Goddamn Buick motor! Anyways, is the Series II also a TPI motor? I thought it was just an SFI motor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 12, 2002 Report Share Posted December 12, 2002 I have not seen a newer 3800 with tpi, but ya never know. I do not recommend putting them in any cars though because you are limited to what you can do to the internals of the engine. Also, if you try to make it too powerful, they are known to blow up. The 60*'s are better as far as I am concerned. If you want to do a lot of internal work, then go with a 3100, or a 3400. The only 3800 that can handle the extra power is the SC because it got the reinforced block, but because it is a split pin design on the crank, then you really can't do too much to it. JUST MY OPINION. YOU CAN DO WHAT YOU LIKE. Taylor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBuick Posted December 12, 2002 Report Share Posted December 12, 2002 I believe all 3800s are tuned port injection. That is waht those "muscles" on the top of the motor are, like you see on an LS1/LS6 . As far as it being weak.....that isn't what I heard....but regarding the design I understand what you are saying and yes they do have that design, but I remember talking with a Buick tech and also Lorenzo about the robustness of the 3800s, particularly the series 1 both SC and N/A. In series 2 form only the SC version is built up. I love my 3800 and love its powerband. I just wish I could take the whole thing and increase it a la supercharger. True that as of now my mildly modded 3.4 will rape it, but I attribute that mostly to the 5-speed. Once Intlcutlass and I get all the 5-speed parts/shipping worked out and I put it into my 3.8.....I dont think it will be as big of a difference then. -T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 12, 2002 Report Share Posted December 12, 2002 yeah, I should have worded that a bit better. I do not like the 3800 myself, but it usually pretty reliable as long as you don't mess with it. The SERIES 1 is better in my opinion. With the SERIES 2 (which is what i was talking about) the N/A block is weak compared to the series 1, and the series 2 SC. I think that the stongest one made was the 3.8 TURBO that was put in the Grand National. I am mostly disgusted with the design of the motor. I know that I would be in serious trouble if I was to say that to the GP people, but I have seen cars in the junkyard that have blown up motors, I have talked to Lorenzo (I used to want to put a 3800 Series 2 SC in my Cutlass, but after he explained a lot of the stuff, to me, I saw it in the junkyards, and I read for myself (not to mention that it has been 30 years, and Buick still does not have that motor as good as it should be), I do not think that it is that great of a motor anymore. I see it as being a good motor for people that don't want something to work on. Something that all they have to do is put gas in it, oil changes, and an occasional tune-up. As to it being a motor that I would want to try to build up for myself, I will not touch that motor. It is in the same place to me as the DOHC (another motor that I think is a piece of work). After learing that Buick kept it a split pin desing with a separate oil pump, and other things, then I do not want to have anything to do with that motor other than if I was just buying a car to use as a beater. Taylor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBuick Posted December 12, 2002 Report Share Posted December 12, 2002 As far as the series 2's, I agree, but I think that abuilt 3800 series 1 would not be as bad as you think it would. True it is at its best in exactly the job you describe, but built similar to a GN motor (which CAN be done), it is not that bad of a motor, and not one that I am afraid of turboing. As far as the DOHC, yes its a pain and with odd idiosyncracies, but when running properly and mated to a 5-speed (and ONLY a 5-speed), it is a pleasurable motor. Mine has 101900 miles on it and it pulls hard and fast without a lick of trouble. But yes I see your point about it. Don't you just love talking MOTORS!!!!!! Not all this silly street racing BS, just plain MOTORS! -T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Posted December 12, 2002 Report Share Posted December 12, 2002 could you explain the split pin deal and how it differs from the design of a 3.1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luminator94 Posted December 13, 2002 Report Share Posted December 13, 2002 Well, my 98 GTP has the 3800 S/C, and I wish my other 2 W-bodies had this engine. The whole powertrain is about damn near bulletproof. Excellent take off, midrange, and top end speed. But the setup is pretty hard to work with. Aaron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GnatGoSplat Posted December 13, 2002 Report Share Posted December 13, 2002 I don't know the specifics of the split pin crankshaft design, but it's typically used on engines that are naturally unbalanced (90-degrees is balanced for a V8, 60-degrees for V6 and V12). Since the 3800's are a 90-degree block V6, they are unbalanced. The split pin crankshaft is supposed to reduce noise and vibration by allowing smoother even firing. The 3800 also has a balance shaft to further reduce noise and vibration. I have never seen anyone mention the split pin crankshaft as an area of weakness and it's used even on V6 offerings by Mercedes so I wouldn't consider it a weird GM design or anything of the sort. The fact that these engines show up grenaded at junkyards means little, considering GM uses it in probably 60% of its fleet. It's also the base engine in F-bodies so many of those engines were probably abused. You will often see grenaded LT1's and LS1's at junkyards, but those engines are among the best designed V8's available and the number of trashed ones is probably due to they're being used mainly in F-bodies. F-bodies don't have high insurance premiums for no reason. At junkyards that have mostly older cars (like the one I go to), there are FAR more grenaded 2.8's and 3.1's. It's not uncommon to find a 60-degree block with a thrown rod. The 3800 (series II at least) have many good design traits as well, such as cross-bolted caps and crankshaft driven oil pump. If GM had used a crank driven oil pump on the 3.4 DOHC, one of its common (and very expensive to repair) problems would have been eliminated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBuick Posted December 13, 2002 Report Share Posted December 13, 2002 in addition, the series 1 3800 is supposed to be heavier-built than the series II version. I know for a fact that it has cross-bolted mains. Don't dismiss the 3800 motors, it is my belief that they are the most reliable W-Body motors made, and I'm sure others would agree. -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2002 Report Share Posted December 13, 2002 Aboslutely, the 3800 is a great motor. Argueably one of the best engines GM has designed. It can last forever, makes respectible horsepower in all of its forms, provides smooth power and is just a great engine. Quite honestly, the Buick guys are lucky (at least as far as most 96 and older W-body cars go). The Regal's with the 3800 engine make for a great car to play with and own. I know it is not really W-body, but I like the old black T-type Lasabre's. (is it a lasabre? it has the flip forward hood, coupe, looks like the same chassis setup as a Delta 88 coupe). That would be a nice car too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperBuick Posted December 13, 2002 Report Share Posted December 13, 2002 yes, lesabre T-Type, a nice car indeed, especially in black! -Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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