joey b Posted July 6, 2004 Report Share Posted July 6, 2004 If I limit the first gear to 35, will it shift out of gear at 35 in all gears, even 1st? or just in the other gears? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrandPrix34 Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 I guess if I had NO option for manual control, I'd set the shiftpoints at the following rpm: 1-2 6700-6800rpm (~47-48mph) 2-3 6200-6250rpm (~82-83mph) 3-4 6000rpm (~125mph) Rev limiter 7000rpm (for holding 2nd gear in the 1/4 ) About to send back the chip to FFP for re-shifting the shift points... Bigbuls, you have sold me on these shift points...now its time to see the results. July 16th I have a track day with STCGP and sure enough I will test both the stock chip and the FFP chip with recalibrated shiftpoints...And no doubt, all will be on tape (Digital8 to me more exact). Vids will also be posted, along with nonessential and rather irrelevant titty shots from random girls. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 Hope you have a spare trans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGBULS Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 Just remember what I said about where *GM* rates the 4T60-E to. *I* think going 200-300rpm past the limit (6500rpm is the GM recomended 1st gear shift limit if you recall.....per the old GMPowertrain webpage) is an acceptable "risk", and SHOULD still allow the trans to have a long service life (assuming it's currently in good condition), but nothing is 100% guaranteed And remember that even raising the 1-2 shift this much (400-500rpm over stock) isn't going to make a RADICAL difference in your 1/4 time..............we are talking about something like 0.05-0.15 seconds here (about a "tenth".........or ~1 car length)............but when combined with manually holding 2nd gear through the traps, is going to make a *noticeable* difference over just putting it in "D" (and the difference between a win and a loss in a close race). You COULD also raise the 2-3 shift past ~83mph/~6250rpm and the 3-4 past the ~6000rpm/~125mph I recomended, but since you can manually hold both gears to the OPTIMUMUM shiftopoints (6700rpm and ~6500rpm respectively), I erred on the side of longevity there (staying within the GM proscribed limits) Anyway..........unless one of the two PCM guru's (Vegeta or Brian) can figure out a way for you to have a 7000rpm 1-2 shift by selecting "1", while ALSO keeping a lower shiftpoint (say 6500rpm) in "2" through "D" (so you can stick it in "1" for max performance at the strip, and the other positions to keep the tranny alive on a day to day basis), I'd recomend going to FFP with the following: 1-2 47mph (~6700rpm) 2-3 83mph (~6250-6300rpm) 3-4 125mph (~6000rpm) Rev limiter at 7000rpm No governor (set at 255mph which is the PCM max) And then just leave the EGR and thermostat where you want them (I don't know what benefit you'd get from turning the EGR off though). As for kickdowns.........you could raise them probably 10% over stock for more agressive downshifts for better passing too. Maybe look at triggering the kickdowns at the following speeds under WOT: To 1st gear........0-39mph To 2nd gear.......40-75mph To 3rd gear........76-120mph And 121+ have it just hold 4th........ These are rough guidlines as I'm not *certain* what the stock LQ1 kickdown speeds are (maybe you can tell me.........I'd bet something like 35mph is tthe limit for 1st, 70mph for 2nd and who knows for 3rd?), but going off of other 60-E's these should be a little higher than stock and give a pretty nice pull from any kind of a rtolling start (considering the new set of shiftpoints)...............I'd also look to see if they can enable 3-1 and 4-2 kickdowns (currently the trans only goes down 1 gear at a time...4-3-2 etc) for even faster reactions (DHP does this for their OBDII PCM's). All of this together should make your car a little faster and quite a bit more agressive in most situations. Good luck, and I hope you like the new setup (whatever you decide). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 With my mods and testing at the track, no dyno tho, I have figured out that it was fastest to run 1st to about 7100, 2nd to 7, and just ride third out, crossign the line at like 6800. But when I get to the track next, I will need 4th. So I will go out of 3rd at 6500. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 The shift tables are based on TPS. There is normal and performance for shift points, and I have no clue what makes them different. Id be more into trying this shit out if I had a car here and the owner who wanted it done. Ill work on getting some of the shift values up so you know what stock is and what is available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 Ok, will excel work ok for you? I can export the output in GMPCM to excel and then label everything and put them into a file. Gonna take me a bit but its all the shift points stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGBULS Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 Ok, will excel work ok for you? I can export the output in GMPCM to excel and then label everything and put them into a file. Gonna take me a bit but its all the shift points stock. Sounds good...........almsot everybody has Excel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrandPrix34 Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 Ben, I would more than be happy to test out the settings wit my DOHC. I know we're literally miles apart, but I am more than willing to pay shipping both ways as many times as possible. Not only will it benefit me, but also any 4T60E nut out there who has no option of a 5 speed swap. If the trans dies, fuck it, life goes on. Either a new trans or new car (currently looking at a fiero for the DOHC swap 8) ) So either way the car goes, im h appy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 I have the tables done...now im working on the constants. Its a lot of entries so I hope this ends up helping something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 http://60degreev6.com/Sappy/34DOHCtransshift.xls Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian89gp Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 There is normal and performance for shift points, and I have no clue what makes them different. Notice the 2-1 shift points, the "perf/snow" is set to 0 for most of the table, that means that you pretty much have to floor it to get it to downshift into first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heza Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 There is normal and performance for shift points, and I have no clue what makes them different. Notice the 2-1 shift points, the "perf/snow" is set to 0 for most of the table, that means that you pretty much have to floor it to get it to downshift into first. thats how my auto 4t60e works. if i dont push the pedal to the floor, it will work through second gear. sometimes even then if i push it to the floor and im after 30 or so mph it still stays in second. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted July 9, 2004 Report Share Posted July 9, 2004 But how does it differentiate between normal and snow/perf. And wtf is snow/perf! hahaha. If it is for a seperate input switch that can be wired into the computer, then the 4T60-E could have a performance shift switch to be more aggressive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian89gp Posted July 9, 2004 Report Share Posted July 9, 2004 But how does it differentiate between normal and snow/perf. And wtf is snow/perf! hahaha. If it is for a seperate input switch that can be wired into the computer, then the 4T60-E could have a performance shift switch to be more aggressive. LMAO, you don't remember me talking to you all excited about this around a year ago? The tables are tied to the 2nd gear start switch which very few 91-93 actually got. All you got to do to make it work is wire in a switch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrandPrix34 Posted July 9, 2004 Report Share Posted July 9, 2004 so let me get this straight, you can actually literally TURN ON the performance shifts for the tranny? HELL YEAH! So in essence all I have to do is go through my wiring diagrams and toggle in a 2nd gear switch or am I missing something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted July 9, 2004 Report Share Posted July 9, 2004 Well, you would also need to reprogram the tables to shift for performance, but yes, thats all there would be to it. I remember now brian, I knew we had talked about it but never did anything with it. I guess now im gonna have to do something with it:P Would be best to use the firewall plug and wire it up there but that is gonna be a LOT of work to do on the inside of the car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrandPrix34 Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 Vegeta, I am going to ship the chip back to you tomorrow with the reprogrammed shiftpoints and hopefully i have the chip back before the 16th (friday) for the ClubGP track day here at Edinburg, TX. Do you think there is enough time? If not, I'll overnight it! And for wiring it, hell I have the next 3 days off since I'm switching jobs and to top it off, I am getting paid for 2 of those days (last of the vacation hours from my old job!) WooHoo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 Hard to say cause it takes 2-4 days both ways to do this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrandPrix34 Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 its all good, if I don't have the FFP chip back before the 16th, I'lljust use the stocker and see what that deletes off... Tell you what, I'll overnight it both ways. Even if it isn't enough time, it's all good, I can't wait to see the end results! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrandPrix34 Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 can't find the wiring diagram in my boxs and I have all 3 factory repair manuals....for a 93 too... Would this come out of the ECM? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heza Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 yeah, all '94-96s got it. 2nd gear start. stupid and worthless as hell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 yeah, all '94-96s got it. 2nd gear start. stupid and worthless as hell. I just don't think a 3.4 even CAn do a 2nd gear start.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmokesGTP Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 I've used it in the snow before, It's actually quite useful in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 Its very hard on the trans though. I would convert it to a performance shift over a snow shift. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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