sl3196 Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 i stay here because once you get past the shit list of w-body.com assholes there's quite a few good people here who will help out when i have a problem Your on your own list! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gp90se Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 I have always liked the theory behind amsoil, but you only send in the oil for tests every what, 15k? There is a risk of getting a contaminant in the oil, and letting it stay in there for X amount of miles doing damage until the test results come back. Im not sure if you have a magnet on your oil filter or not, but it does give a little more protection from the filter. personally, I had run everything from 10w30 synthetic to 20w50 maxlife with everything in between and found the synthetic to run cleaner but take a lot longer in the mornings to warm up in the morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f_399 Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 your getting amazing miles on amsoil! i am currently using royal purple and have 6000 miles on it. Should i change oil now or wait a couple more thousand miles also i use regular oil filters, what filter do you recomend for using with royal purple or any high grade synthetic oil? keep us updated on the progress of your amsoil test Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gp90se Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 Royal purple id dump at 6k and change it, mobil 1 has a pretty good filter but a good ol delco filters all ya really need Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian P Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 Dr. Zoidberg soaking in Brine! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
93CutlassSupreme Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 i stay here because once you get past the shit list of w-body.com assholes there's quite a few good people here who will help out when i have a problem Your on your own list! there's worse assholes on here than me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THe_DeTAiL3R Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 i stay here because once you get past the shit list of w-body.com assholes there's quite a few good people here who will help out when i have a problem Your on your own list! there's worse assholes on here than me Every thread you keep putting down your car. If you want answers to problems you have with it then thats cool.. thats what this place is for. Maybe some of us have pretty good luck with our w-bodies, ever think about that?? So please, STFU if you got nothing worth posting! I hope next time you do you fucking get put in the courthouse! Back on track.... I'd personally love to try out a good synthetic oil, just at 217,000km I'm too scared I will develop oil leaks, and I don't want to tear apart the engine to change gaskets. When I finally have a "project car" (which will likely be RWD and DEFINATLY manual trans) I'd like to tear the engine down to the bones and run synthetic from the get-go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
93CutlassSupreme Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 damn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pitzel Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 I noticed right after the change that AMSOil tends to run cooler than Mobile1 but this difference only lasted for the first 5k or so. Then it was just like Mobile1 as far as heat goes. Dave each of those numbers are indicators of things like oil additives and engine wear. There are a few guides online that explain what each number means. I figured with all your research you would know that. I'm not familiar with the AMSOIL additive chemistry, but generally the big things to be concerned about are Si (from poor air filtration/vacuum leaks), sodium/potassium (coolant ingress), tin and lead (main bearing wear), iron (corrosion), and TBN. The molybedum and calcium would appear to entirely come from the additive package in the oil itself, as would the boron. My only suggestion would be to try a different oil analysis outfit next time around, for example, Blackstone Labs, instead of the AMSOIL-affiliated OAI. I am not in any way challenging the credibility of OAI, but its always great to have a second opinion. Also, since you live in Minnesota, would a 0W30 oil not be more appropriate? I know here in Saskatchewan, we see -40C weather consistently December through April, so the 0W30 formulation has the ability to significantly reduce wear and make cold starts easier. Other than that, keep up the good work, and maybe I'll send some of my Mobil1 in for a UOA one of these days. After I rid my car of the orange cannister of death (FRAM oil filter) perhaps. One question for you, you say AMSOIL 'runs cooler'. How exactly are you measuring this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitcor Posted October 12, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 I ran the first test at 10k, most of the docs I have read as well as the info from OAI, Blackstone and others reccomend a testing interval of 7500-10000 for a gas engine. I was farily sure that the oil would easily make it to 10k which is why I pushed it. I think the next test interval will be at 7500 just to be on the safe side. I will be using OAI again since I have already purchased the test kit. I plan to do further testing with the next oil change just to be sure of the interval so I may use blackstone or another facility just to see the difference. As for how I know it was running cooler. I have an aftermarket temp gauge that is much more sensitive and more accurate than stock (Autometer Colbalt electronic). When I switched from Mobil1, which I had been running for the last 3k miles, to AMSOil the coolant temp was on average 3-5 degrees cooler in all running conditions than with Mobil1. Ambient temps at this time of year (late July) were pretty much stable (70-80 degrees) and humidity of coruse was varible depending on the day. This temp difference was only noticeable for about the first 5k miles on the oil. Since then its been pretty much the same as Mobil1. I may try 0w30 for the winter, we shall see how 5w does at least untill the end of novemeber early december. Thats if I even decide to drive the car through the winter, Im debating on getting a beater. Being a Florida car orignally (my home state) this car has never seen a winter and thus is in much better condition than most cars that are almost 10 years old in this area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveFromColorado Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 Manitcor, you've also got the benefit of a fairly low mileage engine to test these "extended oil life" experiments with - you're well past the brake in period, but your not past the "worn out" stage - thus the oil life will be longer. It also sounds like you've got one of the few properly functioning PVC systems too with the fact it detected 0% fuel in the oil ... which is good. I'm scared to try to run oil that long in any of my engines - mostly because they're all higher mileage - yes I run full synthetic, and I've tried Amsoil, and Royal Purple, but I noticed my oil temperature was actually cooler, not my coolant temperature when I was using Mobil 1. Coolant temperature changes due to changes in the cylinder itself, different oil will stick to the chamber walls differently and reflect heat differently - if you were to watch an EGT gauge and an oil temperature gauge, you'd see the differences there I guarantee it. I don't care what ANYONE says, ALL internal combustion engines will burn some oil, it's how they were designed, that's what the oiling ring does, it coats the cylinder with oil and leaves a film .0001" - 0003" thick, you're stupid to think it won't ever burn that off. Also, I'm still trying to figure out what those numbers represent next to the different items, is it parts per million, or grams, or parts per some other measurement? Finally, wouldn't copper also be one of the ingredients from either the intermediate shaft oil drive gear, or from the bearings themselves, or even part of the camshaft lifter assemblies? --Dave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitcor Posted October 12, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 I would like to get an oil temp gauge eventually, then I will have a better reading, coolant is about all I can go by right now. There is a camaro doing these tests at every thousand miles also with a young engine. Apperently a high copper content is due to the cam breaking in. Its seems that they take forever to do so as they are also still having high copper readings though mine are much better. The report I recieved does not specify what scale the measurements are in but I intend to find out. I'll let you know. Of course I know oil will always burn some off, I keep an eye on the level and find I have to add a small amount of oil every 3k or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveFromColorado Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 .. my oil burning comment wasn't directed towards you, it was more of a general comment for everyone to understsand that it will happen, and to also show that some oil will get into the chamber reflecting the heat towards the exhaust ports rather then allowing it to be absorbed into the metal and and then into the cooling system. --Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteOut Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 It also sounds like you've got one of the few properly functioning PVC systems too with the fact it detected 0% fuel in the oil ... which is good. --Dave. Dave, not to nit pick, but this could also be a function of when he sampled the oil as well. Fuel content in the oil will fall dramatically after the engine comes up to temperature due to evaporation. I'm not 100% sure but I believe most oil sampling kits instruct you to sample only after your car is up to operating temperature to ensure a homogenous sample. Oh, and after browsing some forums it appears that the concentration levels are in parts per million (or mg/L if you prefer). High silicone levels can also be caused by an over oiled K&N or similar filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitcor Posted October 13, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2004 Dave, not to nit pick, but this could also be a function of when he sampled the oil as well. Fuel content in the oil will fall dramatically after the engine comes up to temperature due to evaporation. I'm not 100% sure but I believe most oil sampling kits instruct you to sample only after your car is up to operating temperature to ensure a homogenous sample. Oh, and after browsing some forums it appears that the concentration levels are in parts per million (or mg/L if you prefer). High silicone levels can also be caused by an over oiled K&N or similar filter. Yes the kits do instruct you to take the sample at operating temp which was a pita, I burned my hands trying to keep the pan bolt from coming out. You have to let the oil drin some before taking your sample as you dont want a sample from the bottom of the pan. I think im going to get a valve when I change the oil next time. Interesing note on the silicon, sometimes I do go nuts with that filter oil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOHCRagtopguy Posted October 13, 2004 Report Share Posted October 13, 2004 This is a very intersting thread. I have been reading Bobthoilguy's website and I was thinking of getting the oil analyzed on our LQ-1s. Mine has 124K on it and hers has 108K. They both are running great (knock knock) hers makes a little rappy lower end noise that I think is a worn bearing. How much do those kits cost and what is the turnaround time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manitcor Posted October 13, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2004 $21 from amsoil per test kit (the only way to get a test kit for OAI), took about a week to get the results back. Other labs do testing as well, im not sure what they charge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pitzel Posted October 14, 2004 Report Share Posted October 14, 2004 Oh, and after browsing some forums it appears that the concentration levels are in parts per million (or mg/L if you prefer). High silicone levels can also be caused by an over oiled K&N or similar filter. 'overoiled'? Sure you don't mean 'underoiled', as in, the filter doesn't have enough oil to adhere to the dirt? I always thought that the only drawback to over-oiling was that you have an excessive amount of oil entering your throttle body and intake, ultimately causing instrumentation such as the MAF to be fouled. I could be wrong, completely wrong though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteOut Posted October 14, 2004 Report Share Posted October 14, 2004 Nope, I meant over oiled. The oil is mineral based and apparently contains a good amount of silicates so over oiling leads to the excess oil being "blown" into the intake and eventually the cylinders where it gets burned or mixes with the oil. Over oiling any performance filter can cause this. As a side note over oiling is also a common cause of MAP or MAF sensor failure as the tiny thermoresistor eventually builds up a coat of filter oil and its resistance changes thus precluding the sensor from working properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pitzel Posted October 15, 2004 Report Share Posted October 15, 2004 As for how I know it was running cooler. I have an aftermarket temp gauge that is much more sensitive and more accurate than stock (Autometer Colbalt electronic). When I switched from Mobil1, which I had been running for the last 3k miles, to AMSOil the coolant temp was on average 3-5 degrees cooler in all running conditions than with Mobil1. Ambient temps at this time of year (late July) were pretty much stable (70-80 degrees) and humidity of coruse was varible depending on the day. This temp difference was only noticeable for about the first 5k miles on the oil. Since then its been pretty much the same as Mobil1. Sounds fairly consistent with AMSOIL vs. Mobil1, the AMSOIL starts out generally with a lower viscosity, but has a general tendency to suffer viscosity thickening somewhat more rapidly than Mobil1. Needless to say, with the AMSOIL, viscosity thickening, and not TBN depletion, likely will be the main determining factor for lubricant service life. Running an oil that more closely resembles a SAE 50 grade in the crankcase doesn't tend to be very economical, and the fuel savings should justify dumping out the oil for new stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoke1991 Posted October 19, 2004 Report Share Posted October 19, 2004 i know i argued with manitcor about this b4, the whole concept is awsome. but it just comes down to preference and with my lifter ticking 3.1 with 170,000 on it, ill change the oil every 3000, even if its not braking down as fast as i think. IM just afraid of somthing braking in there with me not knowing and having it floating through my system for a longer period of time. im just waiting for somthing else to go wrong with the engine. once i do my engine swap, yes i will use a full syn, and i will run it for a much longer mile period. if the manufactures are saying change it this and that, ill do it. I dont like to take risks thats all. cool information btw manitcor. Good luck with the testing, id like to see some results further down the road! also btw, last time srry about flaming with you ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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