GM agrees to cover 3100 3400 3800 S II and 4.3 Intake seals

[ns87]

Do you hate everything anyone has ever done?

 

Glad to hear GM is covering the LIM gaskets finally

[Brian P]

The 60* engine has been completely redesigned including the release of an Overhead Cam VVT 3.6L. The 3500 and 3900 are OHV and VVT design with excellent reliability, power (making 240 HP without a blower), and value. The archaic 3800 is as good as extinct save for a few being dropped into some Buicks. The V8's continue to be a great powerhouse for the Y-body and trucks, and are praised by the many. You really need to read up on this, this has been news for a few years now. Engines themselves are NOT a problem for GM so long as they use good friggin intake gaskets.

 

Oh, and 5,6,8, etc speed automatics are a gimmick. They help with sales from people who won't know better, that's about it.

[BIGBULS]

I just disslike the fact that this is a DEXCOOL lawsuit..............and yet EVERY *educated* tech that I've talked to agrees that it's the GASKETS.

 

Dexcool may not be perfect (FAR from it), but this is kinda retarded. I mean, the SLUDGE repairs they refer to on the S/T trucks is due to customers driving the vehicles when they are LOW on coolant (due to crap-ass LIM gaskets)............this causes rust buildup in the top of the radiator end tanks, and BLAM.........sludge city down in the heater cores.

 

And as for Series II 3800's...........95-00 cars have LOWER intakes with too large on an EGR port, that gets hot and WARPS the upper intakes (plastic), springing the gaskets..........and left unrepaired, THIS can cause an internal leak that can hydrolock the engine, foul the plugs and even kill the starter (the nose drive can break off when you try to start a completelty hydrolocked engine).

 

Finally..........3100/3400 cars....... the 94-95 cars have JUST as many LIMG problems (percentage-wise) as 96+ cars.

 

 

 

Basically...........note one thing:

 

3100's appeared in 94

3800 SII's appeared in 95

4.3's were redesigned in 96

3400's appeared in 97

 

Dexcool appeared in 96............

 

All at about the same times.

 

So yeah..........it just happens that these engines all suck ass and Dexcool doesn't have SHIT to do with the problem.

[Crazy K]

So yeah..........it just happens that these engines all suck ass and Dexcool doesn't have SHIT to do with the problem.

 

I disagree. I think the dexcool makes then gaskets fail faster, but they all do fail. let me repeat, the gaskets ALL FAIL, but I think the DEXCOOL ACCELERATES the process of failure!

 

 

 

 

LET ME EXPLAIN:

I've pulled several intakes off and these engines.

 

Vehicles originally produced with dexcool have more "expansion" affecting the silicone seals, where pressure and pitting have allowed the silicone seals to creep and leak.

 

I've pulled several 94-95 intakes and found the silicone seals unmoved, despite the surrounding nylon material having cracked, flaked, and vanished. no creeping, little or no leaking.

 

 

do you understand what I have said?

[93CutlassSupreme]

Do you hate everything anyone has ever done?

 

 

w00t for ignorance

[BIGBULS]

So yeah..........it just happens that these engines all suck ass and Dexcool doesn't have SHIT to do with the problem.

 

I disagree. I think the dexcool makes then gaskets fail faster, but they all do fail. let me repeat, the gaskets ALL FAIL, but I think the DEXCOOL ACCELERATES the process of failure!

 

 

 

 

LET ME EXPLAIN:

I've pulled several intakes off and these engines.

 

Vehicles originally produced with dexcool have more "expansion" affecting the silicone seals, where pressure and pitting have allowed the silicone seals to creep and leak.

 

I've pulled several 94-95 intakes and found the silicone seals unmoved, despite the surrounding nylon material having cracked, flaked, and vanished. no creeping, little or no leaking.

 

 

do you understand what I have said?

 

I understand, but I have NOT seen the same thing. Most of the ones *I* see and from the gaskets cracking and moving or just warping and leaking...............and as I mentioned before, you have JUST as good of a chance of a 94-95 3100 or 95 3800 leaking coolant as a 96+.

 

Also, I know it's not quite a valid comparison, but I have ALSO seen close to a dozen cars that had Dexcool as OEM fill, get loaded with conventional and come back with leaking water pumps (the big weak link that the silicate antifreeze's chew up).

 

 

Either way...........experience and opionion vary a bit, but even if Dexcool IS a contributor (which *I* rather doubt...........or at the least, it is not a PRIMARY cause), you can NOT tell me that these are well designed gaskets to begin with.

 

 

 

 

 

Finally, Mopar 5 year antifreeze has the same OAT additives that Dexcool does (AND silicates), and outside of water pump outlet tubes on 2.7L DOHC's leaking all the time, THEY don't have to worry about coolant leaks like GM does.

[5speedz34]

What about the 350? Basically the best executed engine in terms of longevity. Its basic design has lasted over 50 years.

 

I guess I should rephrase what I was saying. GM is building some of the best cars they've ever built in comparison to the rest of the automotive market. They have cars that truly is being liked by the random jackass.

 

The 2 things that fucked the Big 3 are:

1. The fact that they totally fucked up small cars in the 70's and 80's allowing for the japs to gain a footing.

2. The media, there is so much of a bias its ridiculous. You should hear what the average jackass says about domestic cars. Its filled with ignorance and stupidity.

 

Like Brian said, the 3800 is all but gone. Whether or not its old tech, it was consistently rated one of the best engines. GM built over a million of them. The 60* family has been completely redesigned compared to what it was a few years back. The 3.6 VVT kicks ass. GM builds OHV engines great so I don't see the problem with them continuing to do that (other than the fact that the media will say GM is stupid not to). I love OHC engines myself but hey I guess don't fuck up a good thing?

 

I've never driven a I5 or I4 Colorado but those trucks are totally screwy anyways. The majority of them are Isuzu. The I6 engine has gotten constant praise and is a great powerplant. Those I5's are pretty powerful for what they are. Granted, I think GM is going to get out of the small truck game myself. The 4.3 is a nice engine if you want to drive 80's technology. The fueling system is a joke and they are loud, brash, and idle shitty. Not to mention for the power they make they get terrible gas mileage.

[Crazy K]

well.. I do have to replace a waterpump on the 4.3 in the truck... and I want to do intake gaskets asap too. You could be correct on that, that mixing coolants kills it.

 

 

I agree the gaskets are a poor design, and i do see ones that have leaked as well, but at a seemingly higher mileage or under more abuse or neglect.

 

When I did the intake gaskets on my 94 3100, they were original with 161,000 miles. (verified by the date stamp on the gaskets) the silicone rings had not budged, much of the plastic was gone, and the area was pretty pit free.

 

perhaps the dexcool...

...causes the silicone rings to swell and warp?

...develops more pressure and pushes the silicone rings sooner?

...is more slippery and allows the silicone rings to slide easier?

...s propensity to pit the aluminum is causing the silicone rings to slip?

 

[93CutlassSupreme]

What about the 350? Basically the best executed engine in terms of longevity. Its basic design has lasted over 50 years.

 

I guess I should rephrase what I was saying. GM is building some of the best cars they've ever built in comparison to the rest of the automotive market. They have cars that truly is being liked by the random jackass.

 

The 2 things that fucked the Big 3 are:

1. The fact that they totally fucked up small cars in the 70's and 80's allowing for the japs to gain a footing.

2. The media, there is so much of a bias its ridiculous. You should hear what the average jackass says about domestic cars. Its filled with ignorance and stupidity.

 

Like Brian said, the 3800 is all but gone. Whether or not its old tech, it was consistently rated one of the best engines. GM built over a million of them. The 60* family has been completely redesigned compared to what it was a few years back. The 3.6 VVT kicks ass. GM builds OHV engines great so I don't see the problem with them continuing to do that (other than the fact that the media will say GM is stupid not to). I love OHC engines myself but hey I guess don't fuck up a good thing?

 

I've never driven a I5 or I4 Colorado but those trucks are totally screwy anyways. The majority of them are Isuzu. The I6 engine has gotten constant praise and is a great powerplant. Those I5's are pretty powerful for what they are. Granted, I think GM is going to get out of the small truck game myself. The 4.3 is a nice engine if you want to drive 80's technology. The fueling system is a joke and they are loud, brash, and idle shitty. Not to mention for the power they make they get terrible gas mileage.

 

I've never said anything against the SBC.

 

The I5 is a joke. GM recently enlarged because the 3.5L version just didn't cut it. That's also why GM is now offering the 5.3L V-8 in H3s. My I5 equipped, regular cab 2WD Colorado had 3.73 gears and my 3.1 Multiport Cutlass was still faster to 50 mph.

 

I never meant to get into this but the discussion lead to my belief that GM keeps chassis platforms and powertrains around way longer than they should have. The Cobalt and Ecotec I4 should have happened 15 years ago, instead of keeping the J-car and the POS 1.8/2.0/2.2 OHV I4s around for almost 30 years now. The 3800 should have been replaced 15 years ago by the LQ1, revised with a timing chain instead of a belt. The 4300 should have been replaced 10 years ago, but not by the I5. The I6 would have been a better substitute. It's just the same with the 125C/3T40. It is a shame that GM built cars with a 3 speed transmission into the late-90's.

[5speedz34]

I was using the SBC as an example.

 

I really think the I5 and the I4 wouldn't have been enlarged w/o the H3. It's based off those trucks and is heavy. Trucks aren't supposed to be fast. I would venture that my 4.3 Sonoma is just as fast as any 3.1 car. There is a member on here who has a 2wd Colorado with a stick and that car is quick!

 

The only thing I disagree with is the 3800. As stupid as that engine is, lol, its great for reliability and fuel mileage.

[93CutlassSupreme]

I was using the SBC as an example.

 

I really think the I5 and the I4 wouldn't have been enlarged w/o the H3. It's based off those trucks and is heavy. Trucks aren't supposed to be fast. I would venture that my 4.3 Sonoma is just as fast as any 3.1 car. There is a member on here who has a 2wd Colorado with a stick and that car is quick!

 

The only thing I disagree with is the 3800. As stupid as that engine is, lol, its great for reliability and fuel mileage.

 

I'm pretty sure that Colorado is modded, and we all know what a manual transmission will do for a high-winding OHC engine. The 4L60E isn't exactly geared for performance either. The 2004R was geared much better, but GM discontinued it. And I know trucks aren't supposted to be fast, but I paid $1000 extra for the I5 so I wouldn't have to drive a car with a 10 second 0-60 time.

[Euro]

It's modded in the form of a Flowmaster muffler and K&N intake. I think they're pretty quick. I ended up being the DD one night and had to drive my friend's 05 quad cab I5 and it definitely felt quicker than my GP, let alone my Lumina.

[ZoomZoomFan]

My car had the original DexCool in it when I had a coolant flush done last summer, and I put DexCool back in it. I'm pretty sure the LIMG was done before I got the car though.

[Canada]

I have read most of this post....and there is really only one other person that has a clue.

 

Just like with the Firestone tires on Ford Explorers lawsuit......they've got a good idea, but are blaming the wrong thing. Not really the tires fault, but more Ford's fault for specing a low pressure trying to get a nicer ride out of a truck. Team a low pressure with people that don't take care of their vechiles (like checking tire pressure).....you get a really low tire.....and then it blows out. Now EVERYTHING made from 2008 on has to have a tire pressure sensor. Thanks.

 

The plastic gaskets suck. I don't care how many times they 'update' it...it still sucks. The Fel-Pro Problem Solver intake gaskets don't leak....green, orange, or whatever 'universal' long life coolant out there....it won't leak.

 

Someone mentioned the good ol' tree-fif-tee (gen 1 small block).....they leak just as bad when they started using plastic gaskets in it......

 

The 3500/3900 have been leak proof so far....even the 3400 in the Equinox has been leak free. Speaking of which, anyone ever smell an early Equinox's coolant???

 

Dex-Cool may not be the best coolant out there....but its a heck of a lot better than using green coolant. Which NO ONE replaces on time....which can lead to WAY worse things than a lower intake gesket.

 

i can only imagine what will come of this lawsuit *IF* it goes all the way through.

[White93z34]

I agree 110% with you, Canada. I'm going to be doing intake gaskets on my bonneville this spring, and everyone keeps telling me "OMG SWITCH TO GREEN COOLANT DEXCOOL IS EVIL". No, pathetically designed intake gaskets are the cause of the problems here.

 

On Bonneville club they seem to believe that dexcool is all things evil, and that it pits the aluminum intakes, well the green coolant, if not cared for can do far more damage to a cooling system, including eating away at aluminum!

 

The whole dexcool lawsuit is completely stupid if you ask me.

[5speedz34]

I agree with you Canada.

 

Ford specs 26 lbs on those tires!

 

BTW, when the fuck did you get a SKY?!

[MRMONTELUV]

OK NO PROBLEM IM LOOKING TO KNOW HOW DO WE GO ABOUT FINDING OUT WHAT DEALERSHIP TO BRING THE VEHICLE TO

[BIGBULS]

BTW, when the fuck did you get a SKY?!

 

He collects cars like fags collect blowjobs

 

(Oh my......I am NOT a nice person..........but you get the idea ).

[IRONDOG442]

Yeah I figured you werent a nice person but I still like ya

 

I also figured you liked it up the ass, I am probably not wrong there either.

[Canada]

I agree with you Canada.

 

Ford specs 26 lbs on those tires!

 

BTW, when the fuck did you get a SKY?!

 

November of 2007. They had 0% and gave us a pretty good deal on the Cobra for trade....I couldn't get my employee discount on it as it was some sort of GM fleet car. It had just over 2k miles and was still sold as a 'new' car.

 

Its more or less the fiances car than mine.....at 6'6" I can barely squeeze myself in it to drive it. In fact, I have to take my shoes off to get enough clearance. A teleosopic column would help out.