ZZP L36 supercharger kit?

[bluegtp91]

Someone please explain to me why you’d put an LS1 with a 4T65E?

 

 

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Because the 4T65E can hold quite a bit of power if you don't drive it like a toolbag.

 

I had slicks on mine cutting sub 2.0 60's all day long for a year+ before I shredded the diff.

 

Tossed a new one in there with a filter change/pan drop.  Too many people have issues with the transmission usually because of the high mileage, lack of care, or shock tire cleaning/3-1 & 4-2 downshifts.

 

I had LS4 issues because of heat.

 

There is always a way around it; but then again all this FailWheelDrive never helps.  A 4T80 would be the best option but that's WORK.

[wstefan20]

Haha you should drive to missouri! There's always around 10 L67 cars for under $1000 here usually good body shape but bad transmissions or knocking engine. Seriously though, if anyone is near Missouri and needs an engine, I can get an entire L67 or L32 engine with supercharger, injectors, and the works for around $150 on half off days at my junkyard. There's a ton of them in there right now too! Most under 200,000. Some under 100,000. 

 

Last time I pulled an engine, it took me a little less than 30 minutes (I've learned a trick or two from the folks in the junkyard). I'd grab one for myself, but the wife's already about to kill me for car stuff! haha

 

I say start with L67 if you can find it cheap though, but remember, a straight body and good interior with a blown engine or trans is worth WAY more in the long run than a neglected one with a good engine. (unless you have a bunch of body work experience)

[l67ss]

Wstefan20...I just noticed you're from raytown. I'm from warrensburg originally

[wstefan20]

Wstefan20...I just noticed you're from raytown. I'm from warrensburg originally

Haha nice! Too bad you're not there now! I think there's only a few of us left in Kansas city now. Dark is the only one I know on the forum currently.

[l67ss]

I'm not too far away. North Arkansas. Kinda cool having the meanest w in the area where I live. Course the bar isn't set high here lol

[wstefan20]

haha I'm sure it beats mine at the moment! And hey, if you're ever in the area, feel free to drop in!

[GTP21]

Haha you should drive to missouri! There's always around 10 L67 cars for under $1000 here usually good body shape but bad transmissions or knocking engine. Seriously though, if anyone is near Missouri and needs an engine, I can get an entire L67 or L32 engine with supercharger, injectors, and the works for around $150 on half off days at my junkyard. There's a ton of them in there right now too! Most under 200,000. Some under 100,000.

 

Last time I pulled an engine, it took me a little less than 30 minutes (I've learned a trick or two from the folks in the junkyard). I'd grab one for myself, but the wife's already about to kill me for car stuff! haha

 

I say start with L67 if you can find it cheap though, but remember, a straight body and good interior with a blown engine or trans is worth WAY more in the long run than a neglected one with a good engine. (unless you have a bunch of body work experience)

I need a l67 or a short block but I think I bent a valve

 

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[Marshal]

I love my GXP, so far no issues. I only drive aggressively sometimes. It sure as hell beats the cookie cutter Cruze that got traded in for the GXP. For the record, the engine is an LS4, not exactly and LS1, but close enough. the block is all aluminium, the heads are aluminium. the whole engine weighs like 60 lbs more than the L67, but makes like 50 more hp/tq. 

[wstefan20]

I need a l67 or a short block but I think I bent a valve

 

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Sounds like fun to me! I never get tired of helping out w-body members! Just send me a pm with details!

[KnightOwl]

I have to admit, the big draw for me with a 4.6 Northstar or a LS4 W-body was the V8 noise. Turbos and blowers are cool in their own right but nothing beats the growling noise of a NA V8 with a good exhaust system. If I hadn't been shopping on such a tight budget I would've snapped up the GXP Bonneville in a heartbeat....or the Monte SS but it got sold before I even left work that day. All the talk about durability has its merit, but for guys like me that don't do the dragstrip thing and just want a fun, good sounding car for the sheer pleasure, durability isn't as much of a thing as long as you do maintenance. The ZZ SSM90 kit is a bit pricey, but if you do a top swap right and rebuild the heads and blower for reliability, that cost gets closer in a hurry. The kit also offers the ability of an easy switch back to NA components if you chose to go that route. I don't discount the option of the top swap, but getting salvage yard components is time and labor intensive as well as the installation.

[wstefan20]

good points knight owl! I have to agree with you on the noise aspect.

 

If I had the $2000+ dollars required to rebuild a northstar engine the right way, I'd love to do so and have the 4T80E stability in there. 

 

Personally, if I was just going for v8 sound daily driver, I'd rather have a northstar with 4T80E than a LS4 with 4T65E any day!

 

Unfortunately, one of my buddies is a transmission specialist who has seen hundreds of these 4T65Es, many out of LS4 cars that were never taken on the track and were babied from the start. I've personally rebuilt a few of these transmissions myself, so I know what's in there, and its not that impressive compared to the 4T80E. They were never designed for the power, and no amount of changing shift points and keeping out of the pedal will keep this thing from giving out eventually. I'm not saying you won't get 100,000 miles out of it first, but it's going to go.

 

As far as the zzp ssm90 kit, I agree, It'd be really cool to have the option to go back. Although all of the aftermarket fuel rails are for the L67 and won't fit the L36 as far as I know (maybe things have changed). Talk to your local machine shop too, mine stated that if I brought them the rails and injectors that they could bore the holes for me, so that might be an option for you.

 

In the end though, I completely agree, it's up to you and what you like. We're just here to give advice and stories! Good luck!

[digitaloutsider]

It's your money, man. But it would be a very, very frigid day in hell before I pay $1800 for stock L67 power, and shame on ZZP for milking new/ignorant (I use that in the most literal term, not saying you're stupid) owners.

 

A top swap isn't rocket appliances, and plenty of novice owners have done it before. I'm not sure where you live, but I'd guarantee you can find someone knowledgeable who would be willing to lend a hand with the job. There's no reason to rebuild a blower, so there's no cost there. A Gen III M90 and LIM can be had for >$100 all day long, and I'd seek out some low mileage heads, put new seals on, freshen up the springs/throw rockers at it, and call it a day. On top of that, as Scotty stated, the SSM90 belt routing is stupid and prone to slippage if you go anywhere under the "stock" pulley size. 

 

A day at the junkyard, and a weekend playing GM legos and you have boost for a fraction of the cost of the ZZP kit.

 

I realize this is a personal choice, but in the 15+ years I've been around the 3800, I've never seen a single person go back to N/A (unless they moved to L26 heads/manifolds for a turbo setup).

[Imp558]

It might be an interesting plan to take the focus off the engine build for now. If you put resources into stuff like headers, exhaust, brake and suspension for the time being the L36 is still a fun engine to drive. In that time a good low mile L67 could pop up or top swap parts could fall in your lap.

[KnightOwl]

I truly appreciate the frank response, and I agree the lower cost route with stock parts makes lots of sense. I guess my work schedule has always conflicted with other folks who have weekends off, so I've gotten pretty accustomed to going it alone or paying someone else to get the work done while I do the same.

 

Both 3800 cars I've had before were NA, and they were indeed fun to drive. I will most likely go the same route of mods just like I did before, exhaust, brakes, intake, and other dress-up items both inside and out. I always considered boosting both those cars but never did. I suppose I just assume with this being a planned long term ownership, I might actually get around to it this time! LOL No such thing as too much knowledge beforehand.

 

Its good to know early on this board has such a well-versed group of owners. Thanks guys!

[Grandprix1]

It might be an interesting plan to take the focus off the engine build for now. If you put resources into stuff like headers, exhaust, brake and suspension for the time being the L36 is still a fun engine to drive. In that time a good low mile L67 could pop up or top swap parts could fall in your lap.

X2 on the L36 being fun to drive! I’ve got impala SS brakes with an intake down pipe, tune, and front and rear strut tower bars. This thing is a blast to drive!

[Imp558]

X2 on the L36 being fun to drive! I’ve got impala SS brakes with an intake down pipe, tune, and front and rear strut tower bars. This thing is a blast to drive!

 

 If you think about it that makes more sense. A car with a shit ton at the crank that doesn't handle well or make you proud enough to look back at it isn't as fun to drive.

Tires can make a HUGE difference too.

[KnightOwl]

I took my 01 Grand Prix to Texas Motor Speedway for a Laps for Charity event. I had equipped the car with poly bushings, KYBs, and lowering springs along with some sticky 245/45/18s. I stayed until they shut the lights off that night, getting in four runs, the last two being great fun since the crowds had died by that point. My L36 had the Powerlog, downpipe w/hi-flo cat and Thrush mufflers, drilled-slotted rotors w/ceramic pads, K&N intake, ZZP HVTB, and HV3 insert. The last run was the pace car, me and a Porsche. I think the pace car driver wanted to go home because he got lost in a hurry (It was an Impala SS btw)and I let the GP run high on the banks. It stayed planted much better than I expected, but coming off the back straight at 110 had the little guy behind my eyeballs saying "Hey dummy, you gotta drive this thing back to Virginia tomorrow!) So I backed down...but wow! So on the whole, I really cant say a blower would have made that experience any more exciting. As a matter of fact, one of my friends there with a GTP swapped cars with me for one run, and he came back saying, "I'll never call that car slow again." LOL

[Grandprix1]

 If you think about it that makes more sense. A car with a shit ton at the crank that doesn't handle well or make you proud enough to look back at it isn't as fun to drive.

Tires can make a HUGE difference too.

Thats 100% true. Thats where I get most of my enjoyment out of the car. I can fly down some of these curvy roads that I know most cars on the road wouldn't take or drivers that are confident enough to push the car that far. Is it dangerous yes very but I've learned a lot about how my car handles and how far I can push it.

 

going into corners once you realize your going WAY to fast you can't use the brakes because it just further upsets the chassis. you learn that very quick in autocross. the only real way to slow down is either start dropping gears or hold on tight and push the car to its maximum lateral force and let the friction help slow you down.

 

if you can use the whole road your even better but I don't suggest doing that unless you know the road very well and its a very low traveled road. but learning the brakes is key... they can help you out a lot or they can just piss the car off to the point that you have virtually no control and its scary if you don't realize that. 

[Imp558]

Hard driving really should be done more on the tracks. No families on their way to dairy queen getting in the way.

[Grandprix1]

Hard driving really should be done more on the tracks. No families on their way to dairy queen getting in the way.

True but the only track around me is Summit Point and that would kill my car. Ill put it this way. my cousin with his Camaro and Corvette won't go to any road course tracks like that because they are so hard on the car. 

[KnightOwl]

I can see both sides of that point. I took my Taurus to Virginia International Raceway for a Laps for Charity event and promptly warped a rotor. The track is a thing of beauty with rolling hills, banked and downhill curves both tight and sweeping. Its great fun to drive but hard on the throttle and hard on the brakes is more intense than any freeway on ramp. On and off ramps free of traffic are generally where I like to feel the cornering power.  A few select locations near me combine both a sweeping ramp that dumps into a long acceleration lane before merging...those are my faves.

[Nas Escobar]

Hard driving really should be done more on the tracks. No families on their way to dairy queen getting in the way.

I haven't seen one of those in years...

[wstefan20]

I haven't seen one of those in years...

Lol I'm guessing you live up north? They're everywhere in NC!

[GTP21]

Thats 100% true. Thats where I get most of my enjoyment out of the car. I can fly down some of these curvy roads that I know most cars on the road wouldn't take or drivers that are confident enough to push the car that far. Is it dangerous yes very but I've learned a lot about how my car handles and how far I can push it.

 

going into corners once you realize your going WAY to fast you can't use the brakes because it just further upsets the chassis. you learn that very quick in autocross. the only real way to slow down is either start dropping gears or hold on tight and push the car to its maximum lateral force and let the friction help slow you down.

 

if you can use the whole road your even better but I don't suggest doing that unless you know the road very well and its a very low traveled road. but learning the brakes is key... they can help you out a lot or they can just piss the car off to the point that you have virtually no control and its scary if you don't realize that.

I love flying down 2 roads at night bc there curvy and I can see someone coming. You got to know how your car going to react to things, back tires are super important and over looked bc the w body the ass end come around on u quick if u hit a hard corner and wrong tires on back

 

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[Grandprix1]

If the backend is coming out on a FWD car on clean dry pavement your doing something VERY wrong.

 

 

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