'89 GTS vs 3400 Alero

[TurboSedan]

i raced an Alero from a dig tonight - i whooped it pretty good :) we both had quite a bit of tire spin off the light but i quickly walked ahead of him. i really thought he would get a good jump but he didn't! we raced up to about 50mph or so, right where i was at the top of 2nd gear. i can't remember how much ahead i was, but i think it was about one car length or so (hard to tell since i was ahead). this is the same Alero that absolutely murdered my Cutlass awhile back :) i think it's a '00 model. i know it has a 3400 and i think it might have a CAI or cone filter or something.

[SigEpCutlass]

Mal,

Nice kill. What's the deal on the cutty. LoL! Beef up the 5spd!

[digitaloutsider]

Nice run! :wink:

[TurboSedan]

i was sooo intimidated at the light because i remember how this Alero killed my Cutlass...bad. the perpendicular traffic light turned yellow and i seen him load the TQ converter and i was like "oh shit..." i guess i was afraid the Alero was just going to shoot ahead of me again....and that i would dump the clutch and have to dig myself out of a hole. that Alero seemed so fast against my Cutlass. we both launched pretty even from the sounds of it. but....when the tire screeching stopped i shot ahead. i grabbed 2nd gear and gained alot of ground then. i talked to him later in the night and he even told me if we had gone faster i would have been way more ahead.

my Cutlass is soooo freaking slow! stock 3.1s with 220,000 miles are just slow...even with a 5-speed. i actually raced my Cutlass against my GTS while my brother was driving the GTS...back when the GTS had full manifold pressure to the wastegate (like 4psi) and the original ultra plugged up stock exhaust. it ran dead even with it from a dig up to about 50mph. 4psi is a whole lot different than 12psi :) with 12psi & larger exhaust the GTS now has a problem losing traction in 2nd gear. when racing the GTS from a dig it seems like i have to shift to 2nd instantly or the tires light up and RPMs skyrocket. i am having a problem getting traction in 2nd also ecspecially if the pavement is smooth :(

[SigEpCutlass]

damn the 12psi owns. 8)

[BIGBULS]

Hmmmm.......one car length (maybe a little more) by 50mph, and pulling (off of a relatively even launch). That could easily turn into 6+ car lengths by the end of the 1/4, or still be only one car ahead (or even lose ground, although I rather doubt that).

How hard were you starting to pull on him when you shut down?

Either way...........if you can hang with a GTP, I think it very likely that you'd be quite a ways out on the Alero by 90ish mph (end of the 1/4). They (3400 Alero's) run around 15.6-15.8@86-87mph in the 1/4 (well driven), where a fairly average GTP can crack 14.8-15.0@92-93mph (that's 7 car lengths or so right there....and pulling).




It's interesting going from a car that you think is reasonably fast to one that's a whole lot quicker isn't it......... I remember going from my old Accord hatch (a 98hp '86 DX 5 speed) to my Grand Prix (210hp '91 SE 3.4L DOHC 5 speed) and thinking the GP was a beast. Now I think it's slow..............weird how your perceptions change.

[sl3196]

Hey josh it's a '99 and he has a fenderwell intake. He called me last night and told me ya whooped him. :lol:

Give me a call today josh!

[TurboSedan]

Hmmmm.......one car length (maybe a little more) by 50mph, and pulling (off of a relatively even launch). That could easily turn into 6+ car lengths by the end of the 1/4, or still be only one car ahead (or even lose ground, although I rather doubt that).

How hard were you starting to pull on him when you shut down?

Either way...........if you can hang with a GTP, I think it very likely that you'd be quite a ways out on the Alero by 90ish mph (end of the 1/4). They (3400 Alero's) run around 15.6-15.8@86-87mph in the 1/4 (well driven), where a fairly average GTP can crack 14.8-15.0@92-93mph (that's 7 car lengths or so right there....and pulling).

It's interesting going from a car that you think is reasonably fast to one that's a whole lot quicker isn't it......... I remember going from my old Accord hatch (a 98hp '86 DX 5 speed) to my Grand Prix (210hp '91 SE 3.4L DOHC 5 speed) and thinking the GP was a beast. Now I think it's slow..............weird how your perceptions change.

i'm not exactly sure how much i was pulling on him - i wasn't running by him but probably a quick walk. had we raced fast enough for me to get into 3rd, i think i would have been walking him even more. my car seems to pull real good in 2nd and 3rd.

and yes i know what you mean about perceptions. i used to think my Cutlass was a little quick, but whenever i drive it now it just seems painfully slow (time for some boost :) ) it's still fun to drive with the 5-speed, but it is not fast at all.

[TurboSedan]

Hmmmm.......one car length (maybe a little more) by 50mph...



BTW - what does 1 car length mean? does it mean the other person's front bumper is at your rear bumper, or does it mean there is actually about 1 car length between your rear bumper and the other person's front bumper? cuz when i raced the Alero i think there was about 1 car length (at most) in between our bumpers. it was hard for me to tell tho, i didn't want to look behind me while racing :) i know his front bumper was further back then my rear bumper tho....

[Canada]

It means from whatever placement the cars started at, the other car pulled one car legnth......so it depends how you intially compare the cars..............if both front bumpers where ever from the get go..the faster has one car inbetween its front bumper and the slower cars.

Or.....beings that its only one car legnth........the rear bumper of the faster car is placed at the front bumper of the slower car......IF.....the front bumpers where dead even.

Get it?

[TurboSedan]

in that case i pulled about 1.5ish car lengths on him...2 car lengths at most.

[BIGBULS]

Ah............very nice.

I would think that your car is a very low 15 second or high 14 second car then (especially since the Alero had a CAI).

I think your match against the GTP should be pretty interesting.





Now..........just to keep things even :wink: :

Tell the GTP to launch in "2" (it still starts in 1st gear, and shifts 1-2 at 5800rpm...............if you try to launch in "1" it'll go to 2nd on it's own at only 5400rpm), let it shift into 2nd on it's own (at the afforementioned 5800rpm), and then hold 2nd until 5900-6000rpm (you want the 2-3 shift to go off as close to the revlimiter [6K] as possible without actually hitting it), then go directly on up to "D" (it'll still hold 3rd), because in "3" the car has a governor at 108-110mph (in "D" it'll hold 3rd gear to @5K/122mph and then hit a second governor at 126-128mph).

It sounds goofy, but that's the way the GTP's PCM is set up (I can give a better explaination if yomy last one was too confusing).

The keys for the GTP are: a good launch with the tires sqeeling, but not actually spinning (you want to keep them *just* on the edge of breaking loose until around 20mph which is about where you can be at full throttle), and then holding 2nd gear to 6Krpm (which is a lot better than the 5400rpm 2-3 shift in "D")..............and to not forget to go directly up to "D" after the 2-3 shift if you are going to higher speeds.......have to avoid governor #1 :D

[iTurbo]

Turbocharge the Cutlass already! Turbo Dodges are fun, but I want something different to play with! How can you stand looking at all those homeless TGP parts in the garage?

[TurboSedan]

Turbocharge the Cutlass already! Turbo Dodges are fun, but I want something different to play with! How can you stand looking at all those homeless TGP parts in the garage?

i have to admit - i lost ALOT of interest in the Cutlass after i got the GTS back on the road last month :oops: :D for right now i'm going to concentrate on getting my 2.2 T2/A555 back in the GTS - hopefully in June sometime. you do want your 2.5 T1/A568 back don't you iTurbo? i've only been 'borrowing' it since December :lol:

[excelsior]

figured youd win....i stayed within a car length of my friends alero to 80

[TurboSedan]

The keys for the GTP are: a good launch with the tires sqeeling, but not actually spinning (you want to keep them *just* on the edge of breaking loose until around 20mph which is about where you can be at full throttle), and then holding 2nd gear to 6Krpm (which is a lot better than the 5400rpm 2-3 shift in "D")..............and to not forget to go directly up to "D" after the 2-3 shift if you are going to higher speeds.......have to avoid governor #1 :D

doubtful that Dan and i will race fast enough to worry about the governor :) i think the rematch is going to be from another 30mph roll up to 80mph or so....but i would really like to race from a dig too! i just hope i get a good launch and don't miss the 2-3 shift. Dan - let me know when you can run that GTP again 8)

[sl3196]

I saw ya last night going around the cruise but never caught up to you! I have plates on my car now.

[BIGBULS]

I saw ya last night going around the cruise but never caught up to you! I have plates on my car now.

Did you SEE what I wrote about launching and shifting that beast?

Gotta have an even run against the pesky turbo Dodge :P

[sl3196]

Yeah I know to start in 2nd and then shift to drive. My tires are quite new so they dont seem to spin a whole lot. I'll try a little less gas at first and see how the car does.

[BIGBULS]

Yeah I know to start in 2nd and then shift to drive. My tires are quite new so they dont seem to spin a whole lot. I'll try a little less gas at first and see how the car does.

Hey..........if they don't spin, that's cool..........it's just my experience that most GTP's can spin their tires pretty hard off the line.

YOu just need to "skate" them on the edge of adhession. They should squeel but not spin.

And your tranny should react fast enough that you can rev to 5900rpm in "2" before slotting the lever in "D", and still get the shift off before the rev limiter cuts.

Practice it once or twice if there's nobody around (redline in 2nd gear is about 95-96mph).

[sl3196]

With the road we race on I'll have to try the throttle techniqe cause they spin pretty good on that road I think.